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Post by I AM the Way on Oct 14, 2011 11:48:56 GMT -6
This Occupy Wall Street event is not just interesting in and of itself, OWS can also be used to discuss a variety of topics.
For instance, what's more important to the Cult of Cthulhu: a specific, unified vision which only 1 to 3% of the population might be attracted to, or an unspecified, nebulous vision-collective which could attract as much as 10 to 15%? Is it possible for our religion to house both agendas in the same paradigm? What if a handful of individuals feel that such a combination would be untenable - should they leave the CoC to do their own thing, and what would that thing be?
The following are some related questions based on what Masters of the Work have taught us. How much higher consciousness can be sacrificed in order to raise awareness? If being Awake is a limited commodity, then how shall it be divided? When esotericism is readily available, does the perceived or actual value decrease?
If we view OWS from a Work perspective, this is an inevitable part of the system. The pendulum swings one way and then the other. That's how life is, how the world is programmed, and how man functions within it. Just as Neo is part of the Matrix's overall plan. There will always be two major forces opposed to each other like two sides of a coin... just as there will always be the smaller third force like a coin's edge. Everything is separate and systemic, simultaneously.
Awakened individuals have an opportunity to be apart, safe distance from the dichotomy, outside of the pendulum's back and forth motion. In fact, the Left Hand Path is itself a third side because it doesn't necessarily side with Republican or Democrat, but those LHP pillars that motivate select individuals: Autonomy, Power, and Self-Deification.
By His loathsome tentacles,
Venger As'Nas Satanis
Ipsissimus
Cult of Cthulhu
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Post by boksmutant on Oct 14, 2011 21:59:24 GMT -6
Going back down to SD to join in on the protest. You should go to one, the vibe is not like the couple other protests I've been too. You totally get the feeling this isn't going to stop, & with rumors that other parts of the world are joining in only adds to the vibe. All people are doing, is talking & listening to each other, old & young it's awesome! All you do is walk from one group to the next gathering opinions of the discussions. I met a pack of protesters that live by me & were car pooling down at 8am. We'll stay till early morning & then I gotta get up for fucking work on Sun, lame. I must say Cora that the rest of the U.S. is not like S.D. & that I'll admit. It is fucking paradise down here & were rarely mad about anything, & time will tell if we can turn this in to something meaningful. But it's just hard for now to get a handle on what to do next since YES we're all here together, but WHAT NEXT!? Like I said, I'm not sure where to take the protest but I could help push it in a direction if I was inclined. I can be persuasive when I need to be. So I'll ask you guys, what can you suggest we do now that it's in motion? If there was any one time your voice can be heard this is it. Depending on what I see tomorrow, I'll decide if it could either use some lightning up, or alittle more aggression. I can go either way:) Hopefully we can use this to the betterment of all society. Hail Cthulhu! |
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Post by sin on Oct 15, 2011 11:47:04 GMT -6
I made some suggestions a page or so back.
CS
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Post by Cain Da'arnesh on Oct 15, 2011 12:36:58 GMT -6
Boksmutanis! Take heart brother for you now have the support of KMFDM! Check it out! Jules shreds his guitar and Andy just freaking destroys those drums! kmfdm.net/adrugagainstwallstreet/As for pointers, the best advice I can give is to get some people who are also in the protest together and discuss with them precisely what y'all want. That way, it'll take on a more organized and directed effort. Also, you should recruit as many protestors as you can into this faction in order to get the steamroller moving if you know what I mean. From what I've heard, this lacks direction. And you my friend are in a good position to change that! |
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Post by boksmutant on Oct 15, 2011 22:55:09 GMT -6
One protest leader encouraged a family atmosphere to gain more support. They say it's to early in the/OUR game to be violent, though three people were arrested & eight people maced Fri morning when evicting us.
The turn out today was 3 to 4 times more than last week. Teacher Unions came with Nurses to throw in their lot with us! New York came & gave us some direction. I was so tired from Marching that I had to cuddle up with some homeless to take a Knapp lol. Great speeches from some of the older crowed.
The vibe is unbeatable! I can't think of anything but the protesters. Digg.
Awake!
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Post by sin on Oct 17, 2011 8:08:25 GMT -6
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Post by chunksofstuff on Oct 17, 2011 21:04:46 GMT -6
Well, I'll be heading down to San Diego(a few minutes drive)to join in on the protest we're having this friday. I'd love to see which state brings out the most people, but we'll see. What do you guys think of this? Awake! I wrote a song for the protesters because I love the tenacity of these people. The only thing I'm noticing is there's a lot of dumb hippies who are promoting anarchy and taking away from the actual reason the initial protest on Wall Street started, so some media has used that to smear the protests. Their desire to try to hinder the distance between the rich and middle class is, I believe, very necessary for the future of this country... but the greed of the rich is so deep... I dont feel they will make a difference, but I really hope the whole world listens before something really stupid happens... |
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Post by sin on Oct 18, 2011 7:18:31 GMT -6
Greed, is natural and all people are greedy in some way, even the most humble of monks is greedy.
Greed is not the issue, its Envy. Problem is, the 99% aren't envious enough to work as hard as possible to acquire as much, if not more for themselves.
The logic of "The rich get richer and the poor get poorer", is flawed.
www.tenbiggestmyths.net/ideology/marxist.communism/10a.htm
Capitalism isn't the issue, its man's drive towards materialism. One of the biggest criticisms of footage taken of the Protesters is that the vast majority are seen with ipods, iphones, and other material goods which drive capitalism. Man's attitude towards materialism is what drives this society.
I'm reminded of a quote from Bram Stoker's Dracula: (spoken by Van Helsing) "Civilzation and Sypillization have progressed together."
Plaques evolve along with civilized societies. The plague of man is widely accepted because this is the way things are, its acceptable. We are within the matrix of civilized society and its either you evolve with the system or you perish. Those that survive just fine, are typically the EVIL, while those that are barely hanging on by a thread are the victims.
The economy has always been a fluctuating agent, and its not just the local economy either. Things are interconnected on a global scale.
I think its great that people are ready to force the hand of change, they are talking, gathering, but what are they doing to actualize change? This question remains, for me.
CS
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Post by Cain Da'arnesh on Oct 18, 2011 11:16:59 GMT -6
This is big! It's time we take this nation back from the corporations! All I can really do is rant online however as I live in the middle of nowhere. But know that you and the others have my full support!
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Post by sin on Oct 18, 2011 14:16:52 GMT -6
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Post by pseudosherlock on Oct 18, 2011 23:45:29 GMT -6
I agree with Cora'Sahn that it's not accomplishing anything it's trying to. It seems to me to be purely a reaction. It's the last few decades of mental grumbling from people who don't have money judging people who do as keeping them down exploding out into physical demonstrations. Part of the excitement, from people posting here, seems to be more that people are actually getting up and going somewhere to do something other than text and stare at TV. So if that's a result, great.
While I don't think that it will create anything like what the protestors are hoping for, I do think it will create a result. I don't have a wide enough view of economics and the world to guess what it is. However, I'm hoping for my own selfish reasons that it doesn't mean storming the White House and killing everyone in Washington because the average schmoe can't afford five ipods/iphones AND the loan payment on his Escalade. It's not really "let them eat cake", after all.
And I think one of the most damaging things about the protests are how they are judging the government's tactics of violence and oppression and using war terminology like "occupying". War doesn't stop war. Violence doesn't calm down violence.
Finally, unlike other major movements like getting troops out of Viet Nam or freeing black people from legal oppression, there really isn't a clear goal here. It's just anger, and people have become so bedazzled by things that they can't clear their anger enough to realize where there imprisonment and oppression lies, so they're blaming anyone who has more physical goodies. Of course, as knowledgeable people, I'd like to think we're all aware here that the real oppression is from within and their only freedom will lie from self awareness and empowerment, not stopping rich people from getting to their Wall Street jobs.
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Post by boksmutant on Oct 19, 2011 3:57:11 GMT -6
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Post by sin on Oct 19, 2011 7:29:01 GMT -6
money.cnn.com/2011/10/13/news/economy/occupy_wall_street_money/index.htmOccupy Wall Street raises $150K Here is a perfect example (there are other fund-raisers as well), the money raised is going into a 'Occupy Wall Street Journal', for propagating. I'd be more impressed if that money was going towards relief efforts, or funding a candidate selected by 'the people' all its doing is driving more materialism and adding to the problem. This isn't a solution to the gripes of the 99%, this whole thing is ridiculous.
The consumer mass has the power in their hands to change this economic system but remains woefully programmed to do the same thing over and over again.
CS
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Post by sin on Oct 19, 2011 7:36:36 GMT -6
money.cnn.com/2011/10/18/news/economy/cain_999_plan/index.htm Cain's 9-9-9:
"Under the current system, most of the lowest income households end up owing no federal income tax. That's because their incomes are so low that they're exempt, or because their tax liability is canceled out by the standard deduction and tax breaks, such as the Earned Income Tax Credit.
The Cain plan doesn't exempt very low incomes from taxation. And while it would eliminate the payroll tax, which is the heaviest tax for low-income families, that tax relief would be offset for many by the elimination of the EITC and other tax breaks they qualify for now."
The plan may look insane on paper, but I think what Cain is driving at is that the lower-income households are tax exempt. This means, that higher-income households are picking up the slack. You get out there in the world, talk to people, and you realize that many purposely stay in a low income bracket so they are tax exempt. This is just as heinous as those that live and raise families on social programs. The 99% scream economic equality, but they don't seem to want to walk the talk themselves.
"Cain has said his plan would raise the same amount of revenue as the current system. The Tax Policy Center generally concurs with that assertion.
In 2013, the group estimates that Cain's plan could raise about $2.55 trillion. That represents 15.4% of expected GDP, well below the historical average for tax receipts."
CS
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Post by sin on Oct 19, 2011 9:02:26 GMT -6
 "Most discipline is hidden discipline, designed not to liberate but to limit. Do not ask Why? Be cautious with How? Why? leads inexorably to paradox.How? traps you in a universe of cause and effect. Both deny the infinite.-The Apocrypha of Arrakis Discipline, self-discipline is what is needed in this country. Awareness, education, and a focus on what drives the self to act.
Following every whim of your heart's desire is captivity. A disciplined individual is Autonomous, uses his Power, and achieves.
cultofcthulhu.wall.fm/blogs/166
DUNE and the Cult of Cthulhu
Frank Herbert Writes:
"When I was writing Dune
. . . there was no room in my mind for concerns about the book's success or failure. I was concerned only with the writing. Six years of research had preceded the day I sat down to put the story together, and the interweaving of the many plot layers I had planned required a degree of concentration I had never before experienced.
It was to be a story exploring the myth of the Messiah.
It was to produce another view of a human-occupied planet as an energy machine.
It was to penetrate the interlocked workings of politics and economics.
It was to be an examination of absolute prediction and its pitfalls.
It was to have an awareness drug in it and tell what could happen through dependence on such a substance.
Potable water was to be an analog for oil and for water itself, a substance whose supply diminishes each day.
It was to be an ecological novel, then, with many overtones, as well as a story about people and their human concerns with human values, and I had to monitor each of these levels at every stage in the book.
There wasn't room in my head to think about much else.
Following the first publication, reports from the publishers were slow and, as it turned out, inaccurate. The critics had panned it. More than twelve publishers had turned it down before publication. There was no advertising. Something was happening out there, though.
For two years, I was swamped with bookstore and reader complaints that they could not get the book. The Whole Earth Catalog praised it. I kept getting these telephone calls from people asking me if I were starting a cult.
The answer: "God no!"
What I'm describing is the slow realization of success. By the time the first three Dune books were completed, there was little doubt that this was a popular work -- one of the most popular in history, I am told, with some ten million copies sold worldwide. Now the most common question people ask is: "What does this success mean to you?"
It surprises me. I didn't expect failure either. It was a work and I did it. Parts of Dune Messiah and Children of Dune were written before Dune was completed. They fleshed out more in the writing, but the essential story remained intact. I was a writer and I was writing. The success meant I could spend more time writing.
Looking back on it, I realize I did the right thing instinctively. You don't write for success. That takes part of your attention away from the writing. If you're really doing it, that's all you're doing: writing.
There's an unwritten compact between you and the reader. If someone enters a bookstore and sets down hard earned money (energy) for your book, you owe that person some entertainment and as much more as you can give.
That was really my intention all along.
Frank Herbert"
Where Frank Herbert is content to refine the reader through his use of rich metaphor and allegory cautious about his intentions, we choose to refine them through Cultus. Both, are equally captivating. When cultists hear the call, and answer - it is because the Cult is imposing, and with such brute mental force, the shell cracks and a tentacle gets inside. The potential to affect others, the culture we each live in, is limitless. A change in you, resonates outward like ripples in a pond. This takes discipline. Within a body of discipline a deconstruction and reconstruction occurs.
The consumer mass, if educated and aware - has the power to actualize change.
CS
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Post by I AM the Way on Oct 19, 2011 11:58:03 GMT -6
Star Wars OWS propaganda? Awesome!
Dune OWS propaganda? Also awesome! I also liked what Herbert said about the writing being most important.
The Matrix OWS propaganda? Yes! Keep piling on the awesomeness!
From what I've heard, Cain's 999 plan includes the elimination of social security and probably universal health insurance (Obamacare). Really, all the Republican / Tea Party politicians (and their corporate masters, of course) want to do is create a future slave society made up of the bottom 99%.
We've already discussed Ron Paul a bit in that other political thread about the GOP Presidential candidate debates. Check that out.
The Daily Show with John Stewart had an amusing segment on the OWS movement last night. Anybody watch it?
Will this month old uprising continue long enough to put pressure on politicians, creating some kind of economic justice? I guess that's why people occupying.
Awake!
Venger As'Nas Satanis
Ipsissimus
Cult of Cthulhu
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Post by Cain Daarnesh on Oct 19, 2011 15:30:04 GMT -6
It is indeed interesting how those people spent the money they had raised. I believe Einstein was on to something when he said, "We cannot solve the problems of today with the same thinking that created them." And I believe that is the direction this may be taking. However, as Herbert (one of my favorite authors) might say, "She's not done writing just yet!" Meaning the story is not yet over and this could still very well get some change. Most notably, justice on the people who wrecked the world economy with their greed!
And for the record, I do not like Ron Paul or any other Libertarian Candidate. I believe Libertarian ideology is flawed as it leaves the workers and lower classes open to exploitation and brutalization by the upper classes. The original Tea Party believed that government intervention was necessary to keep the wealthier powers in check. The original Tea Party was an active demonstration against tax breaks for a powerful British tea corporation back in it's day. I believe the protestors are closer to the original than the current Tea Party.
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Post by Cain Daarnesh on Oct 19, 2011 15:37:06 GMT -6
I almost forgot to add. Faux News argues that the protest is without direction. I argue that Neitszche was correct when he stated that "Order comes from chaos." Meaning that eventually, this movement will take shape and change something if given enough time.
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Post by I AM the Way on Oct 19, 2011 15:57:57 GMT -6
There's more to Libertarianism than Ron Paul. Imagine a world very much like our own except with a lot of stuff being legalized, such as: marijuana, LSD, mushrooms, prostitution, porn, gay marriage, gambling, and probably firearms.
The essence of Libertarianism is increased liberty. Of course, with power comes responsibility. Can everyone handle the burden of freedom? No, not everyone. However, a certain segment of the population can - and they should be able to enjoy the fruits of liberty without being held down by the lowest common denominator. That is the central pillar of my political philosophy.
Awake!
Venger As'Nas Satanis
Ipsissimus
Cult of Cthulhu
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Post by Cain Da'arnesh on Oct 19, 2011 16:17:35 GMT -6
Indeed Lord Satanis! However, I don't think we're ready for that sort of thing... Just my two cents if you care for a couple of pennies sir!
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Post by ophiuchus on Oct 19, 2011 16:19:42 GMT -6
Yes, but historically the tricky part is determining which segment of the population can handle freedom, and even if some people can, I somehow doubt everyone else is going to sit and accept being told, 'Sorry, you don't deserve as much freedom, cos you're just not as equal as we are.' How would a governmental double standard --libertarianism for the Lovecraftian Theocrats and strict government for everyone else-- work?
Cora'Sahn, I'm surprised at you for swallowing Republican economic nonsense. The poor pay less in taxes because they have less money to pay. The idea that someone would voluntarily be poor just so they could pay less tax money shows less in the way of critical thought and more in the way of making excuses for creating a financial caste system. If you tax people less the more money they have, then the rich will get richer and the poor will get poorer.
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Post by sin on Oct 19, 2011 16:54:22 GMT -6
I beg your pardon Sir, I didn't swallow anything. I'm merely pointing out, that Cain makes a good case, even if his idea won't fly, it may be the catalyst for a much better plan. And I wasn't speaking of 'less taxes' I'm speaking of being tax-exempt which may be an enabler to mediocrity. I think mediocrity is celebrated in this country, people are excused for being mediocre.
The idea that people voluntarily are poor, isn't a romanticism, its a reality. As I stated, you get out in the world and talk to people and how they handle their own finances - people do this, this isn't something you read about in the news. It's fairly common. Some excuse their behavior by blaming social programs that keep them on the program by removing benefits once they are working, or earning more money. It's bullshit, its welfare fraud. People will purposely not work, or work under the table so they can keep their section 8 rent, food stamps, monthly check and its widespread - its not rare.
This of course doesn't count the number of people who would rather depend on unemployment than get out there and find work. I know people in my social circle that do this- they think its 'working the system', its raping unemployment benefits. Benefits,of which corporations pay out every month.
And this is just the tip of the iceberg, merely a couple of examples.
So its an opinion formed on critical thinking and not swallowing Republican economic nonsense. I'm an accountant, this is what I do for work - I crunch numbers. It's just common sense. Benefits offered to corporations generate more jobs to be had. Corporations try to cut corners, as much as the lower-class American. Corporations have to pay more taxes on the profit they turn, payroll taxes, unemployment, and a myriad of other expenses just to keep a business running. Insurance is outrageous, and required by the State - a number of insurances not just one. Bail outs, ensure these businesses keep going so they can regroup not be excused from the debt they owe. Otherwise, cutbacks occur, to include laying people off.
The rich get richer and the poor get poorer is flawed.
CS
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Post by sin on Oct 19, 2011 17:10:20 GMT -6
Thoughts on Libertarianism:
The values are often misrepresented by individuals. Ideally, we want less government involvement in our lives, and more liberties. This is easier said than done. While politicians muddy the ideal with their personal thoughts on the issue, the value of Liberty remains.
If people were more autonomous, there would be no need for an increase in governement control. When Patrick Henry cried out: Give me Liberty or give me death! He would rather die than hand off control to a governing body, an admission of incapability. Handing off Liberty in favor of 'security' - the idea that Big Brother is always watching and has the best interests of the Americna people in mind - psh. That's Slave Morality. Nietsche got quite a few things right, as did Mark Twain. They wrote passionately in hopes that it would jerk people out of their droning states. Instead, we casually quote them when its appropriate, and go back to the regularly scheduled programming.
RISE!
CS
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Post by I AM the Way on Oct 19, 2011 23:13:49 GMT -6
A damn good question! How indeed? Assuming the masses are not enlightened enough to grant a Lovecraftian Theocracy the authority to determine the worthiness of an individual and enforce its evaluations, how should one proceed? I see a few options...
1. Brute force
2. Political maneuvering
3. Exerting our influence in the shadows using Viridian Sorcery.
The first option is nearly impossible. The second is simply playing the sleepers' game. The third, however, has a real chance for destroying generally accepted reality - the Great Old Ones draw ever nearer!
Going back to the first part of your question, "how can freedom worthiness be determined?" I propose a point system where valuable traits (such as loyalty, creativity, and understanding Cult principles) are used to measure the worth of a man. Good behavior yields positive points, bad behavior yields negative points. Those holding the most points receive the most liberty.
Please keep in mind, this is a bare bones model I'm currently working on. Feedback welcome!
By His loathsome tentacles,
Venger As'Nas Satanis
Ipsissimus
Cult of Cthulhu
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Post by boksmutant on Oct 20, 2011 1:09:44 GMT -6
If it does come down to a point system, than I hate to compare it, but Enron had some good techniques they used for their employes. I'll try & find an articles on it but it was strangely appealing to me.
Awake!
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Post by sin on Oct 20, 2011 7:53:03 GMT -6
Point-systems generally degenerate to cults of personality. For me, I don't have to like the person to find their insights genius. I pull from all sorts of minds, even if the behavioral delivery is less than desirable. This is me. It doesn't mean that other people feel the same way I do about it. Who would issue the points? Our peers? You? In what way would they be administered?
One of the social trends I've noticed in the past few years, is a strong focus on 'Merit'. I was listening to am radio this morning, and there it is again - Merit. The broadcaster was speaking about the merit of deeds, vs. words. A politician can promise you the world, but if he doesn't follow through on those promises, how much merit do they actually have? And, when the people don't hold the politician accountable, what does that say about the merit of the people?
It's the old adage: Actions speak louder than words.
If we are to gauge the value of a man by points, I propose it's by the actions vs. the words. We can all be dazzled by prolific writing, and even the writer (back to the idea of cults of personality), but if the writing doesn't have anything to back it - its just waxing politico. Any person can do that. A remarkable man, has something to show for his words.
That's my .02, rinse and repeat.
CS
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Post by glade on Oct 20, 2011 9:05:38 GMT -6
your .02 is always appreciated. you're worth a million in expertise and knowledge.
Awake. Hail Shoggoth
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Post by sin on Oct 20, 2011 11:58:46 GMT -6
Synchronicity. Video published today by Rev. Ronald French of Axis Sanctuary.
!
CS
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Post by ophiuchus on Oct 20, 2011 17:49:22 GMT -6
I apologise, Cora'Sahn. I commented more quickly than I should have. I still believe that taxes help keep the rich from getting richer, etc., but my personal experience probably does not in fact apply to everyone everywhere. The idea of voluntary poverty just to pay less taxes is still illogical, though, so I doubt I'll truly wrap my head around it till I meet someone that lazy.
Behind-the-scenes social control through magick? Sounds like a much better idea. All visible power gets you is blame for when things go wrong.
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Post by lokidreaming on Oct 20, 2011 18:53:02 GMT -6
America missed there chance at solving their money problems by not forfeiting their debt payments this year; if they had, the country would have outside help.
Also USA should implement a plan like China and Russia to move people out of smaller areas or the people in smaller areas should move somewhere else and look for a job (it is called individual responsibility so the individual and stop relying on the govt so much if you don't want to move and know there are no jobs in your area due to the small size)
and how about the govt set up a programme to help people relocate to other areas to find jobs.
LD
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