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Post by jmsn72 on Feb 21, 2009 21:56:15 GMT -6
The think is if its a power fetish,the cultist and a consensual partner can have rape simulations.Hence I say simulations,not literal rape.
IMO it seems like ones dominance is already established when the desired sex are all eyeing you out of uncontrollable lust and beating each other down to merely catch a glimpse of your greatness.I figure at this point your dominance is already established.Not only is your dominance established sexually,you can watch the sleeping hordes pulverize each other like weak meaningless bugs as you tower over them in sadistic glee.
IMO having to go and rape on of these lowly specimens reinforces that the cultist dominance has not been established to themselves or to others.Surely such a case is sad if the cultist truly is a god no?Why would a god need to show their power by doing that when their power is already established and why would a god not know it is a god?
"a power fetish stimulated by sexual dominance over another" seems more accurately worded as it may include a wide array of acts and the concept fits perfectly with the notion the cultist has already established their own godliness.I just felt a line had to be drawn at some point as all.
Coming from an ethnicity where my ancestors were sold as property and constantly raped at their master's whims,surely you could understand my issue with such.I don't mean to draw this out but if slaves just suffer and no lines were drawn at some point,I doubt I'd have to privilege to converse with you and seek to awaken myself.
Since I bought it up,what are your views of any youth or children remaining after Cthulhu awakens?Are they going to be sent to serve as slaves?Or still being young could they be useful and more open to awakening?Will they be given a chance at least?Being born in oppression and being not given a chance to even read some of the prophets books , not being given a choice to embrace a higher understanding ,and never be given the ability to ever make that choice due to a bred servitude would suck IMO.
Or am I wrong at holding some kind of empathy or thinking we should do so?
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Post by I AM the Way on Feb 22, 2009 1:04:48 GMT -6
yes, it's probably best to take all this not so literally... with the rape and the slavery, etc. after all, who can say exactly what the end times will bring?
it does suck. but at least we have a chance. those of us able to escape should do so. according to the universe, the human race should have never amounted to more than plant life.
VS
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Post by apologist1 on Feb 23, 2009 1:37:43 GMT -6
Rape is moronic, repulsive and degrading. It destroys the subtlety of life. Rather than raping someone, why not take time to appreciate da Vinci's use of poise, the sonnets of John Donne or the novels of Tolstoy? Why not learn another language or develop an understanding of calculus? Why not spend time with friends or make love to someone you care for?
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Post by apologist1 on Feb 23, 2009 1:38:15 GMT -6
Copensation for the rape would likely work, take a variable make it positive. Congratulations! That's the most moronic thing I've read this month.
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Post by I AM the Way on Feb 23, 2009 6:39:03 GMT -6
since that comes from the most moronic poster of the month (hey February is a short month!), that's quite the condemnation...
just sayin,
VS
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Post by sin on Feb 23, 2009 9:04:34 GMT -6
since that comes from the most moronic poster of the month (hey February is a short month!), that's quite the condemnation...
just sayin,
VS *lol* I guess it's just easier for some people to insult another, than it is to post an intellectual disagreement to the idea. just sayin...
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Post by I AM the Way on Feb 23, 2009 11:08:09 GMT -6
so my girlfriend is taking her son back to school and gets me up at about 6:00 a.m. so, i'm up while they are getting ready, etc.
i jump on the forum to see if there's anything new and apologist1 has just posted like 10 things and most of them seem purposefully created to irritate people. that early, i did the best i could. still... i think mine was an amusing retort.
i also private messaged him saying only 3 posts a day from him or he's banned again (and probably for the last time).
VS
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Post by sin on Mar 21, 2009 15:05:21 GMT -6
So I take it he's following this agreement?
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Post by whatsupable on May 28, 2009 8:02:12 GMT -6
well about the subject raping in a ritual
first i think after the Apocalypse we are like the Gods and i think we don't have to do a complete ritual to get what we want
if i am ride than we only have to do it now but you probably will go to jail for some time.
also i don't like raping but if we also are killing those we don't like. raping is almost the same.
p.s. i am against it because it get you in jail and don't have the feeling that i will like it
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Post by I AM the Way on May 28, 2009 10:26:44 GMT -6
we must observe the laws of the land... for now.
VS
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Post by Ny'obstaresh on May 29, 2009 0:16:09 GMT -6
It isn't rape... it's "surprise sex" haha.
But seriously, I'll quote something here that my friend says all the time (and for the record, he means it in a very LaVeyan way)
"God helps he who helps himself"
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Post by whatsupable on May 29, 2009 8:58:45 GMT -6
we must observe the laws of the land... for now.
VS so vs when do you think we have the law i think after the Apocalypse because, there are not so many cultists as other religions. and i was thinking other kind of satanists or Fourth way practitioners will they get in to the void to? and for the laws maby a bit over the line will get us in the papers and we get more focus from people but probably bad focus. (sorry for of topic)
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Post by I AM the Way on May 29, 2009 10:34:33 GMT -6
perhaps after, perhaps not...
we don't know what shape or form such an apocalyptic transformation will take place? will it be on a wide scale or individual? will it be part of the illusion that ordinary people can perceive or just something that Cultists can detect? how potent will changes become?
that's another good question. just calling yourself a satanist or practitioner of the 4th way will do no good. one must put in the work and it must be the right work. that's what our school is for... showing the correct path and assisting with the transition.
outrage? definitely. illegality? just asking for trouble. the original Church of Satan used outrageous behavior and high-publicity stunts to get noticed. speaking of which, LaVey's Church of Satan used sex to sell their philosophy, so i think it's appropriate for the Cult of Cthulhu to do the same. and not only sex, but every aspect of our paradigm.
VS
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Post by Lord Void Bharam'ka on May 31, 2009 17:28:48 GMT -6
Alright my $0.02:
Rape=Illegal
I'm gonna stick to the Sex Magick aspect...
First of all I personally disagree that the partner needs to know about the rite... In some cases it's better if they don't know. If they know they can fuck it up... Just like they can help if they know. I've launched countless sigils without my partner knowing...
Investment of Belief is a Mother-Fucker if you ain't in control of it, It's in control of you... conscious or unconscious.
Second like all energy manipulation my question is can you Absorb, Refine, and Redistribute the Energy you are trying to Tap into... If not it's like hooking a $1 Calculator to a Super-Computer and your the $1 Calculator about to get fried... I've been on that receiving end... Tapping into the Dark-Current before I was ready... POP goes your Brain.
So can you handle it? Can you harness and use that energy given off by rape or something as intense and not fuck yourself up is my question?
And what is the most extreme state of gnosis that you've been able to handle?
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Post by Draelloathe on Jun 1, 2009 13:59:24 GMT -6
Surprise sex! ;D
That got a laugh out of me, but seriously. I'm of the belief that the heavens will realign, and that individuals will be empowered due to their enlightenment. Woe behold the democracy, or any social clique then.
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Post by LostSoul on Jun 3, 2009 10:23:08 GMT -6
In my wanderings across the desert that is the world wide web; searching for the truth of the Mythos; I came across this forum; and, as it were, this thread.
Here be a layman's opinion...
First, if one is performing a ritual using sex magick; it's the poor magickian who forgets to have a partner on the ready to help complete the spell.
Second; if there isn't a partner; why bother with with the act of rape; when the magickian could use an enchantment. If he/she is an experienced and practiced spell caster; this should be fairly easy and simple. Not to mention; one should always practice one's craft whenever possible.
Third; if slaves are involved, hypothetically and fundelmentally speaking; they are property - Period. The rights given and expected of free people do not apply to slaves.
Fourth; if rape is to be ever used in ritual; hypothetically and fundelmentally speaking(again); it would, and should, be used for a ritual towards a specific person; the person that is being raped. Such a ritual would be done to control and dominate that person. The act of "rape" would be but a part of the subjucation. The "rape" would open up the person, both psychically and emotionally; allowing the magickian to enter that person's mind and soul in order to gain domination; and eventually, control of said person.
*As for what comes of the "chattle" in the future; and what can, or cannot, be done to them...The answer for that lies in the future; and really doesn't concern the core subject of this thread and conversation. It is though, an interesting subject; and well-worthy of a thread of it's own.*
Finally, lest we forget; in most countries in the so-called, civilized world of men; the act of rape is a criminal offense punishable with upwards of 20 years, to life, in prison. Therefore; for even the most practiced spell caster, the possible outcome of incarciration would far, FAR, out weigh any such benefits the magickian would achieve by such a ritual. There are other spells and rituals one can use for contolling others that would not result in the possible arrest and prosecution of said magickian.
Just this visitor's humble opinion...
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Post by I AM the Way on Jun 3, 2009 13:59:57 GMT -6
a modern magician in these pre-apocalypse times should follow the rules and guidelines of "play rape", if he is to engage in forced/subjugated/degrading sex at all. this would include the consent of another adult, using a safeword, and open communication before and after the faux rape.
by the way, you might want to actually register and post an introduction so we can better know who we're speaking with.
VS
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Post by LostSoul on Jun 3, 2009 19:26:05 GMT -6
Thank you, I would love to register and become a member, sir.
However, I wasn't too sure, in regards to membership in the forum, was in any way a part of becoming a member of the Cult of Cthulhu...I did have some questions regarding that; and, as of yet, still looking thru threads(as a guest); seeking that information.
Of course, I do fail to be as observant as I'd like...The answer may have been blantantly staring me in the face.
Also; I whole-heartedly agree with your comments above. Insightful.
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Post by I AM the Way on Jun 4, 2009 9:21:39 GMT -6
forum membership is completely different than Cult of Cthulhu membership. anyone can join the forum here and discuss issues, you don't need to be a Cultist (though it helps).
CoC membership info: www.cultofcthulhu.net/I-am-the-way-cthulhu1a.htm VS
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Post by Draelloathe on Jun 4, 2009 13:06:35 GMT -6
I think that whether it is, or whether it is not is not the question. I believe it's the the operator that's the effectiveness. But, the board can not, and must not condone non-consensual sex due to laws of the land.
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Post by whatsupable on Jul 16, 2009 8:18:19 GMT -6
well i first don't have the need or guts to rape someone ;D
but also you can maby get away whit it a few times and accomplice a few things and then you get caught and set in jail or worse.
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Post by sin on Jul 16, 2009 11:05:08 GMT -6
well i first don't have the need or guts to rape someone ;D but also you can maby get away whit it a few times and accomplice a few things and then you get caught and set in jail or worse. I've done it a few times in my youth (oh the memories) problem is, my victims tend to like it, after the shock and awe is over. Rape is rarely about the sex, it's a powerplay.
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Post by LostSoul on Jul 16, 2009 15:12:01 GMT -6
I've done it a few times in my youth (oh the memories) problem is, my victims tend to like it, after the shock and awe is over. Lucky victims... Agreed. It's about domination...It's about control...
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Post by Ny'obstaresh on Jul 20, 2009 2:21:22 GMT -6
As a dominatrix (yes, that is my job - and personal preference ) I totally agree with that. It's probably one of the things I get asked about the most when I tell people what I do lol. "why would someone want to be raped?", "Why would someone want to get beaten?", "Why would someone want you to rub Deep Heat on their genitals, stick ice cubes up their ass, and cane them with bamboo?".... Well, I haven't been asked the last one, but it doesn't mean it isn't valid! Heh... What many people don't seem to understand is that in safe BDSM (That's Bondage, Discipline, Sado-Masochism (or Slave and Master) to the newbies ) the Sub is actually the one who is in control. They have power over the use of safe words, they decide the limits, etc. The rest is just an illusion to fulfill a fantasy, essentially. You don't have that in rape, obviously. But rape does fundamentally come back to power-play, as Cora said. The rapist rapes to take control, to possess and own the victim... So, if that was to help a ritual, I guess it's a valid means to an end. But I do think that the validity of using consensual "rape" or actual rape in magick does depend on the aim of the ritual.
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Post by sin on Jul 20, 2009 6:28:00 GMT -6
Amen! You know, people don't get that. When the discussion of BDSM comes up, the focus is on the Sadist rather than the masochist. When I point out, that it's the submissive that is actually in control, people give me that deer in the headlights look.
And it's a 'safe' form of control play; where rape has none of the safety elements. Rape is complete control over the victim, and breaking them. That's the desired goal, to break the person; and they have no choice what so ever - it's not safe. The rapist terrorizes and breaks the spirit of the intended. It can be quite violent, and there are no 'safety' words or ques.
The use for 'true' rape, would be to feed one's ego, and focus that energy on an intended goal. If it's mutual consent, the energy is completely different and it's not about the rapist, but all parties involved in the rape. The ritual goal would be different than an actual rape.
That's just my opinion on the matter.
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Post by Ny'obstaresh on Jul 20, 2009 13:49:29 GMT -6
Wow. Well put. That's pretty much what I was trying to say lol. But I am having trouble expressing myself properly lately, and it's getting worrying... Too much drink, perhaps... Anyway: Yeah, what Cora said!
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Post by bizzzaro66 on Nov 21, 2009 14:40:36 GMT -6
I think luxcthonis is on the right track, the fear factor is an important part of the equation.....what about using rape and ritual sacrifice and intense psycodrama to build fear into an intense climax and using that fear to feed the entities in the other dimensions that are close to us? I think they feed off fear and pain and will reward those who give it to them. The Mayans, Aztecs and many other pre Christian people knew about this....of course all of this is extremely illegal and not advisable in today's day and age....
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Post by melina on Dec 11, 2009 15:30:27 GMT -6
I know many women who theyr fantasy is to ged Raped.... They Love it..... But they dont say it....
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Post by sin on Dec 14, 2009 8:02:10 GMT -6
I know many women who theyr fantasy is to ged Raped.... They Love it..... But they dont say it.... Most women fantasize about it, as if it's something sexy, something hot - but in reality, rape is about taking control away from the person being raped. Most women who 'fantasize' about being raped, might be traumatized by an actual rape.
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Kai'Sigth
Novitiate
Dreaming Herald of the Old Gods
Posts: 10
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Post by Kai'Sigth on Jan 23, 2010 14:14:21 GMT -6
Having never practiced sex magick (put planning to in the future) I am not really sure how forced sex (rape) would influence the workings of the ritual. However, it seems that more energy would be expelled and created in the struggle against the magician, which could be put to use by the practitioner.
As has been said, I believe that there are better ways to exert power and control over another than rape. I don't condone rape, but that's just my stand of it and I have no right to tell others how to act, nor do I really care. My choices are my own and nobody else. However I would be lying if I said I wasn't influenced by social standards and laws. Are we not what we are made to be? Conditioned from the womb to act in a certain manner? Is rape wrong? Well that's not for me to decided. I try my best to eliminate the dualistic thinking of right and wrong. I dare open my mind further. However, Rape is illegal. That much is clear.
I admit that I do fantasize about rape, for many of my fantasies are wonderfully violent and sexually explicit. I am lucky enough to have a submissive girlfriend who also thinks in such a manner and would like to "play rape", however I am not sure what use I would have for it in a ritual context as of yet. Though who knows when the need may arise?
Awake!
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