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Post by Voraxith on Sept 22, 2011 15:16:57 GMT -6
So, I must start this off with an apology--never a good sign, I suppose. This post is self-pitying: not particularly a positive step for a Cultist, I know, so I issue apologies for those it might offend with its blatantly whining nature.
I realized today that the only real godhood I have achieved is that of an RPG G.O.D. (Game Operations Director). My life is a shambles: I've spent a good amount of my time incarcerated for stupid, reckless behavior; I am unable to find a job despite my best efforts (that whole sex offender thing really does not look good on resumes...); and generally speaking I am just negative and overly self-critical. I am just entirely too self-defeating. Suicide is a constant thought in the back of my mind, and the only reason I don't do it is because I know that it would completely and utterly defeat all the work and energy I've put into my Left Hand pursuits.
Today I found out that the Cult of Cthulhu group I started in prison is being taken over by a bunch of namby-pamby whiny-ass know-nothings who 'just don't feel the Lovecraftian element' as applying to the Left Hand Path. But from what I know of these individuals, they know NOTHING of the Left Hand Path, and were always asking me for knowledge on the subject.
Is it wrong for me to feel completely defeated in knowing that what little legacy I had attenpted to build is being washed away by philistines? To know that the hundreds of dollars worth of books that I had donated to this group are being read and utilized by worthless pieces of scum whom I wish I'd had the balls to murder whilst I had the chance?
I try to console myself with the knowledge that there are at least two individuals in the group whom are truly deserving and sincere in their efforts in the Way, and that they are good and worthwhile people whose lives are improved simply by my having been involved; however, it's just two people in prison, and while I adore them and will always count them as my friends and equals, what is it to be equal to shit?
For that is all I am. Shit. Subsisting off the generosity of others (taxes included) for over ten years, with no end in sight. I just retreat into my fantasy world of Cthulhu and vampires and dark clerics with d20's, and I guess I'll just stave off the malaise of my being with happy thoughts for now.
May the Dread Lords of the Outer Spheres arise in power and might to awash us all in Their emerald and eldritch glory from Hell.
[glow=red,2,300]Ia! Ia! Cthulhu fhtagn![/glow]
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Post by dudetyson on Sept 22, 2011 21:47:09 GMT -6
My thoughts, in no coherent order:
You've taken the first crucial step which is total brutal honesty with yourself, about yourself.
I for one see your above little ditty as a great heresy against two most vicious of dogmas: the ego's continual need to praise and justify itself, and the idea that "everything will be okay." I think it is also a powerful act of dark magic in that it transforms your own consciousness and exposes others to the brutality of your situation, inducing them to see the blackness of their own situations. *But don't be too proud of yourself -- take this and run with it or it means nothing.*
Honestly it took me a while to get why exactly Cthulhu was Left-Hand Path too so I am not sure I'd judge these guys too hard. It wasn't Cthulhu that drew me here, honestly, but the fact that this Cult takes a more productive focus on self-construction than the stupid bickering of many satanists, which results from their infantile method of individualism-as-not-being-anyone-else, rather than individualism-as-expansion-via-incorporation.
For being shit, you seem decently literate. Like wow, you can actually string a paragraph together in a way that doesn't hurt to read. Cultists take note.
I for one totally value self-pity. I've been reading some Fourth Way stuff, and while it has some decent wisdom in it, in some ways it suggests the practitioner become an emotionless robot. That's not why I got into this. In fact, the exact opposite. Nor do I respect the path of certain Nietzscheans and Nazis who believe in self-annihilation as strength and honor, for masters OR slaves.
What else can our value systems be based on, but self-pity? It is the core of everything. We have desires, which we sense first and primarily by when they are not being met, ie when there is a distance between satisfaction and reality. All of our striving is out of desire, and fundamentally all our desire is out of self-pity. IF YOU'VE PUT UP A SHELL AGAINST YOUR SELF-PITY, TEAR IT DOWN. DOING THIS HAS BEEN MY GREATEST STEP FORWARD WHILE IN THE CULT.
Perhaps Cthulhu should not be your fantasy, but the brutal judge who scorns your weakness, demanding you get your shit together, snap yourself out of fantasy-land (Awake!), focus on real-life details (where the devil is), and do something with your life.
Your position of economic disadvantage is intriguing, and the opportunities of such a situation have been on my mind lately. Maybe it's time to completely uproot yourself, commit yourself to some vast purpose, and go to a place where you can make a difference. Perhaps in a Christ-like drifter kind of way -- or maybe not, but getting where you need to get with a certain disregard of how stable your situation is. The world is changing, and there is plenty to devote yourself to. While spreading the LHP is good, and I intend to do plenty of that myself, also keep in mind that Matter Matters, don't refuse to partake of the affairs of this world, and as Aquino said, if you have not manifested anything in this life, you certainly won't in the next, and it's doubtful if you even continue.
Consider losing your guilt. It's not like you asked to be born, let alone born into an economy that requires you kill yourself to survive (a paradox indeed). But what you mainly need is a mission, plus getting out of that house and that place. (Believe me, I know, I will be out of my parents' house by November and it will be the best thing to ever happen to my ability to focus on True Will).
Consider this your chance to be Born Again in Cthulhu -- a rebirth consisting entirely of deeds. Just do it. The intensity of this vision is so brutal that I feel like a hideous waste even typing it, rather than devoting this very second to living it myself.
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Post by Voraxith on Sept 22, 2011 23:18:38 GMT -6
Thank you, Dude. Much of that is stuff I really needed to hear. It's funny that you should mention the drifter idea, as that was exactly my plan with my life until the whole 'I went to prison for statutory rape'-thing, because that kind of makes it unfeasible in regards to the law and registration and all that nonsense. Oh well.
[glow=red,2,300]Ia! Ia! Cthulhu fhtagn![/glow]
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Post by I AM the Way on Sept 22, 2011 23:19:46 GMT -6
Many Cultists (and regular folks too) have been where you are now, Voraxith. Cheer up! That might sound worthless, but it's a command... a self-command you can use to pull yourself out of this depression.
Sure, things are tough right now. You're feeling disoriented, disenfranchised, and pissed off that things aren't better. You left one prison only to find yourself incarcerated within a larger one - life. Be patient. As Dude Tyson suggested, try setting yourself to a great purpose.
DT, I've run into others who've come away from 4th Way books with a robotic sense of what the Work teaches. Can you go into detail about why a student might see the Work as training to become an emotionless robot?
Awake!
Venger As'Nas Satanis Ipsissimus Cult of Cthulhu
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2011 8:32:03 GMT -6
Hi Voraxith,
you did well, if you feel bad then admit it and tell it. Altering the reality, the work of a Wizard, cannot be done by ignoring it.
My advise for you, brother : To not identify yourself with your social position. You are not "a jobless guy" you are what your essence is.
And remember that in our pitiful society, our social position is definitively not related to our virtues... Oh no.
Remember yourself, for the emerald kingdom is at hand !
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Post by dudetyson on Sept 23, 2011 9:58:05 GMT -6
Well VS, it was simply that when reading Possible Evolution, I ran into the following.
"Mr. A: The chief immediate objectives you recommend are elimination of emotional life?
Mr. Ouspensky: No, quite different; emotional life most important. The system speaks of elimination negative emotions. Negative emotions are an inter mediate state between sanity and insanity. A man whose centre of gravity is in negative emotions cannot be called sane and cannot develop. He must become normal first.
Mr. A: Why I spoke of the elimination of emotion. Life was because you said that all our emotions are potentially negative.
Mr. Ouspensky: Yes, potentially, but it does not mean that they all become negative. Emotional centre is the most important in us for our development."
I'm afraid I disagree strongly. It seems to be very easy to misinterpret 4th Way as recommending a total emotional blankness, as Mr. A seemed to do. That begs the question of whether there's a reason for this; I suspect people attempt to brutally cram themselves into a model of what the 4th Way says they should be, rather than organically self-observing, seeing what they are, and moving forward from there.
However, my objection is deeper. Any blank-slate dismissal of even *negative* emotions seems to merely reinforce society's standards of what is good and evil, pleasurable or negative. He even calls people with negative emotions close to insane and abnormal! It reminds me of how homosexuality was a psychological disorder until the 1970s.
I feel like the first stage of 4th Way practice should be: Accept Yourself. Once you've done that, then you can move on and try to change certain things, with the wisdom of someone who knows themselves and knows there is a reason for every part of their psyche. Not just the 3 or 4 centers, but *every emotion* means something, serves some role in a person's internal system. But the 4th Way just seems to dive right into driving people towards fitting a certain model.
For me, negative emotions are not something that are supposed to be "productive." They are ME. They are my honest assessment of the rotten world we live in. They are not primarily a tool, though can sometimes be used as such. They are the core which I serve.
Of course in my case, my negative emotions are channeled in fairly constructive directions, and are mixed with a universal compassion and occasional joys.
Most ridiculous to me is the idea that a person centered on negative emotions cannot develop. My life has been centered on negative emotions and I've regardless developed far beyond most people I bump into.
I'm not saying the 4th Way is worthless...indeed, I think my copy of "The Fourth Way" just came in the mail and I'm looking forward to it. I just can't buy into that specific facet of the philosophy.
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Post by Deleted on Sept 23, 2011 11:52:48 GMT -6
For me, negative emotions are not something that are supposed to be "productive." They are ME. They are my honest assessment of the rotten world we live in. They are not primarily a tool, though can sometimes be used as such. They are the core which I serve. I don't think that assessing our world as it's fair value (rotten) is an emotion. That's my point of view, too.
Emotions arise from this assessment, anger is negative and need to "find a way" is positive. I had both, my search for "something better" gave me results, too ; but now I gave up anger and everything is much better...
Awake !!
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Post by I AM the Way on Sept 24, 2011 10:47:31 GMT -6
Well VS, it was simply that when reading Possible Evolution, I ran into the following. "Mr. A: The chief immediate objectives you recommend are elimination of emotional life?
Mr. Ouspensky: No, quite different; emotional life most important. The system speaks of elimination negative emotions. Negative emotions are an inter mediate state between sanity and insanity. A man whose centre of gravity is in negative emotions cannot be called sane and cannot develop. He must become normal first.
Mr. A: Why I spoke of the elimination of emotion. Life was because you said that all our emotions are potentially negative.
Mr. Ouspensky: Yes, potentially, but it does not mean that they all become negative. Emotional centre is the most important in us for our development."I'm afraid I disagree strongly. It seems to be very easy to misinterpret 4th Way as recommending a total emotional blankness, as Mr. A seemed to do. That begs the question of whether there's a reason for this; I suspect people attempt to brutally cram themselves into a model of what the 4th Way says they should be, rather than organically self-observing, seeing what they are, and moving forward from there. However, my objection is deeper. Any blank-slate dismissal of even *negative* emotions seems to merely reinforce society's standards of what is good and evil, pleasurable or negative. He even calls people with negative emotions close to insane and abnormal! It reminds me of how homosexuality was a psychological disorder until the 1970s. I feel like the first stage of 4th Way practice should be: Accept Yourself. Once you've done that, then you can move on and try to change certain things, with the wisdom of someone who knows themselves and knows there is a reason for every part of their psyche. Not just the 3 or 4 centers, but *every emotion* means something, serves some role in a person's internal system. But the 4th Way just seems to dive right into driving people towards fitting a certain model. For me, negative emotions are not something that are supposed to be "productive." They are ME. They are my honest assessment of the rotten world we live in. They are not primarily a tool, though can sometimes be used as such. They are the core which I serve. Of course in my case, my negative emotions are channeled in fairly constructive directions, and are mixed with a universal compassion and occasional joys. Most ridiculous to me is the idea that a person centered on negative emotions cannot develop. My life has been centered on negative emotions and I've regardless developed far beyond most people I bump into. I'm not saying the 4th Way is worthless...indeed, I think my copy of "The Fourth Way" just came in the mail and I'm looking forward to it. I just can't buy into that specific facet of the philosophy. I would feel more comfortable with this: Accept yourself knowing full well that major aspects of yourself will have to be changed very soon.
Like Gurdjieff, Ouspensky is plain speaking. They don't try to easy you into the water as is my usual approach. Ouspensky throws you into the deep end. So, for those reading him... prepare thyself.
Also, Ouspensky's definition of negativity is different than yours. As Yrreiht mentioned, seeing the world as it is (mostly rotten) is not being negative or indulging in negative emotions. Wallowing in self-pity or striking out against innocent people because of this rotten world is the kind of negative emotion Ouspensky refers to.
Awake!
VS
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Post by frateroculus on Oct 25, 2011 2:29:16 GMT -6
Every god has his weaknesses.
Also, pity is a part of your will to power, giving yourself control over the situation by justifying weakness.
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Post by Cain Da'arnesh on Oct 28, 2011 13:02:03 GMT -6
Only if you see yourself that way friend! Belief is reality! Awake!
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