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Post by Deleted on Jul 24, 2010 1:46:34 GMT -6
There is a last thing I don't understand in the Cthulhu Cult paradigm, the definition of some words : Horror, Atrocious, Madness, Morbid...
The fact is that I use to associate them with suffering, weakness, illness, and other negative feelings.
"Priest of Unimagined Horrors" is a new degree ; please give me the exact sense of the word "Horrors" in this context. I tried to find by myself ; in "the call of Cthulhu" Our Drown Lord is described as (translation of a translation that I remember, probably these are not the exact words !) "an horrific contradiction of all the laws of physics". I like it so much ! this is resonating in me, as I view magic as breaking the rules of this universe. So "horrific" is from the point of view of the universe which aim is opposite to ours, right ?
It is written that R'lyeh is a place of morbid delight. As delight, I would prefer sane girls than morbid or dying ones...
Quote from Lord Satanis in the previous tread : "Here are the new degrees, with path signifiers, also known as the Hierarchy of Madness" The way "Madness" is used is disorientating me, please explain !
Ia Ia Cthulhu fhtagn !
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Post by rylehsambassador on Jul 24, 2010 8:53:44 GMT -6
For some of us me included they enjoy reveling in the madness and working on having a sense of control over it. The madness needs to be realized before it can be overcome and controlled.
Awake!
G'Pock Thoth Herald Of the Old Gods Cult Of Cthulhu
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Post by lucofthelight on Jul 27, 2010 4:33:39 GMT -6
Greetings Yrreiht,
I hope this post can clarify some of your concerns. Please note that I'm speaking from my own personal position and am not attempting to speak for the High Priest or the R'hleyan Priests. I do hope that my viewpoints are somewhat aligned though.
The definition of madness;
mad·ness (mdns) n. 1. The quality or condition of being insane. See Synonyms at insanity. 2. Great folly: It was sheer madness to attempt the drive during a blizzard. 3. Fury; rage. 4. Enthusiasm; excitement.
I can understand your aversion to the words madness, atrocious, horror, morbid......etc. From a General Consensus Reality(GCR) viewpoint these descriptions make one feel uncomfortable and ill at ease, causing the individual to run in the opposite direction. After all, in GCR, things and experiences that are beautiful, pleasant and superficial is what's sought after and the horrific, mad and atrocious are generally avoided by most people.
What we are doing at the CoC, the things we are into, the things we practice, would be considered mad and insane by the majority of people we come into contact with. How many individuals that you come into contact with in a single week would even for a few moments consider some of the ideas that are discussed here on the forum? Most people are preoccupied with their jobs, going to the shops, the movies, socializing, partying, hobbies, studying for further improvements in their careers. There isn't a whole lot of time left for delving into the unknown. That's where we come in. We are the ones that occupy this gray area. Out there in GCR, things are black and white, liked or not liked, loved or hated. Rare is the one who looks deeper and considers things from multiple angles.
From this 'normal' viewpoint, we could be considered weird for being interested for more than a fleeting moment in the occult, the supernatural, the esoteric. To be heavily involved in it on a daily basis would be the epitome of madness for many people.
From the Cultists point of view he willingly steps into this 'madness' and attempts to forge his own path and belief structure. This madness could be considered stepping outside the 'normal' belief structures of humanity and operating in the less treaded gray areas in the pursuit of Awakening'. Some will fail and head back into the seeming security of GCR as it is more comfortable there and they can continue along in the natural order of things and remain more or less asleep. What we are attempting is unnatural. It is unnatural to Awaken, to self remember, to self observe. We have to keep pushing ourselves to do it and accept dreadful, horrific truths about our position in the universe. We have to accept our position of being broken machines that work incorrectly and that we are for the most part asleep as the occupant and controller of this machine. This is a morbid and horrible thing to accept. However, it is a necessary step in our pursuit of Awakening.
If things were put across in this Cult as nice, pleasant, beautiful then there would be no real point to it and we would continue to go along for the ride pleasantly sedated. That type of stuff is for the new age movement.
Ia Ia Cthulhu Fhtagn!
K'ara Kaiul Esoteric Herald of the Old Gods Cult of Cthulhu
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Post by Sarak G'hash on Jul 27, 2010 6:23:44 GMT -6
Greetings Yrreiht, I hope this post can clarify some of your concerns. Please note that I'm speaking from my own personal position and am not attempting to speak for the High Priest or the R'hleyan Priests. I do hope that my viewpoints are somewhat aligned though. The definition of madness; mad·ness (mdns) n. 1. The quality or condition of being insane. See Synonyms at insanity. 2. Great folly: It was sheer madness to attempt the drive during a blizzard. 3. Fury; rage. 4. Enthusiasm; excitement. I can understand your aversion to the words madness, atrocious, horror, morbid......etc. From a General Consensus Reality(GCR) viewpoint these descriptions make one feel uncomfortable and ill at ease, causing the individual to run in the opposite direction. After all, in GCR, things and experiences that are beautiful, pleasant and superficial is what's sought after and the horrific, mad and atrocious are generally avoided by most people. What we are doing at the CoC, the things we are into, the things we practice, would be considered mad and insane by the majority of people we come into contact with. How many individuals that you come into contact with in a single week would even for a few moments consider some of the ideas that are discussed here on the forum? Most people are preoccupied with their jobs, going to the shops, the movies, socializing, partying, hobbies, studying for further improvements in their careers. There isn't a whole lot of time left for delving into the unknown. That's where we come in. We are the ones that occupy this gray area. Out there in GCR, things are black and white, liked or not liked, loved or hated. Rare is the one who looks deeper and considers things from multiple angles. From this 'normal' viewpoint, we could be considered weird for being interested for more than a fleeting moment in the occult, the supernatural, the esoteric. To be heavily involved in it on a daily basis would be the epitome of madness for many people. From the Cultists point of view he willingly steps into this 'madness' and attempts to forge his own path and belief structure. This madness could be considered stepping outside the 'normal' belief structures of humanity and operating in the less treaded gray areas in the pursuit of Awakening'. Some will fail and head back into the seeming security of GCR as it is more comfortable there and they can continue along in the natural order of things and remain more or less asleep. What we are attempting is unnatural. It is unnatural to Awaken, to self remember, to self observe. We have to keep pushing ourselves to do it and accept dreadful, horrific truths about our position in the universe. We have to accept our position of being broken machines that work incorrectly and that we are for the most part asleep as the occupant and controller of this machine. This is a morbid and horrible thing to accept. However, it is a necessary step in our pursuit of Awakening. If things were put across in this Cult as nice, pleasant, beautiful then there would be no real point to it and we would continue to go along for the ride pleasantly sedated. That type of stuff is for the new age movement. Ia Ia Cthulhu Fhtagn! K'ara Kaiul Esoteric Herald of the Old Gods Cult of Cthulhu Well said!!! Madness has been normal for me for so many years now..lol. Everyone says that I am insane because of my interests in the occult and I tell them that I do not suffer from madness but enjoy every minute of it! It makes them stop and think even if just for a moment!! Awake!
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Post by Apsara Kamalli on Jul 27, 2010 21:33:39 GMT -6
What we are doing at the CoC, the things we are into, the things we practice, would be considered mad and insane by the majority of people we come into contact with. How many individuals that you come into contact with in a single week would even for a few moments consider some of the ideas that are discussed here on the forum? Most people are preoccupied with their jobs, going to the shops, the movies, socializing, partying, hobbies, studying for further improvements in their careers. There isn't a whole lot of time left for delving into the unknown. That's where we come in. Most people are not preoccupied with these other areas of their lives. Most people choose to be preoccupied. The idea of discussing something as in depth and controversial as philosophical viewpoints is not only unattractive to them but avoided in at all costs. They do not want to come to the realization that their life is an illusion. They are "happier" asleep for ignorance is bliss and delving into the unknown will only create a sense insignificance to the white-picket fence with 2.3 children "ideal" they have placed so much stock into. I think that is a matter of perspective. If you say to me that something is pleasant and beautiful, that resonates positively with me. If you say to some of the other people in this forum that something is dark and mystic, that resonates positively with them. Either way can be used to keep someone pleasantly sedated depending on the person, or group of people, engaged. As for your comment about the new age movement, I caution you about using labels to perpetuate stereo-typical generalizations. The labels we sometimes use can limit our awareness of what is and is not. It can create a sense of "knowing" without possibly having any idea. The new age movement is centered around a belief in coincidences having spiritual meaning and that we are all connected through a "God" energy. It is also a study and internalization of all types of religious beliefs, from Catholicism to Occultism. An intelligent, informed, realistic "New Ager" realizes that life is not about everything being pleasant and beautiful, and there is the "dark side of any concept. Awake! Apsara Kamalli Esoteric Herald of the Old Gods Cult of Cthulhu
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Post by lucofthelight on Jul 28, 2010 6:40:44 GMT -6
What we are doing at the CoC, the things we are into, the things we practice, would be considered mad and insane by the majority of people we come into contact with. How many individuals that you come into contact with in a single week would even for a few moments consider some of the ideas that are discussed here on the forum? Most people are preoccupied with their jobs, going to the shops, the movies, socializing, partying, hobbies, studying for further improvements in their careers. There isn't a whole lot of time left for delving into the unknown. That's where we come in. Most people are not preoccupied with these other areas of their lives. Most people choose to be preoccupied. The idea of discussing something as in depth and controversial as philosophical viewpoints is not only unattractive to them but avoided in at all costs. They do not want to come to the realization that their life is an illusion. They are "happier" asleep for ignorance is bliss and delving into the unknown will only create a sense insignificance to the white-picket fence with 2.3 children "ideal" they have placed so much stock into. I think that is a matter of perspective. If you say to me that something is pleasant and beautiful, that resonates positively with me. If you say to some of the other people in this forum that something is dark and mystic, that resonates positively with them. Either way can be used to keep someone pleasantly sedated depending on the person, or group of people, engaged. As for your comment about the new age movement, I caution you about using labels to perpetuate stereo-typical generalizations. The labels we sometimes use can limit our awareness of what is and is not. It can create a sense of "knowing" without possibly having any idea. The new age movement is centered around a belief in coincidences having spiritual meaning and that we are all connected through a "God" energy. It is also a study and internalization of all types of religious beliefs, from Catholicism to Occultism. An intelligent, informed, realistic "New Ager" realizes that life is not about everything being pleasant and beautiful, and there is the "dark side of any concept. Awake! Apsara Kamalli Esoteric Herald of the Old Gods Cult of Cthulhu I enjoyed reading your response Apsara Kamalli, it certainly opened my eyes to a few things I didn't consider beforehand. While I think it is partly true that people do 'choose' to avoid things such as philosophical viewpoints, etc, I also think that it is natural for them not to think about them. From the viewpoint of the System of the Fourth Way it is the way of things. People are asleep. Things are as they are because that's the only way they can be. As most people fall under the law of accident perhaps they don't so much choose but are naturally diverted away from things that may cause them to think or question reality and hence snap out of their slumber for a short time. I think your comment about definitions such as beautiful, nice, dark, mystic being a matter of perspective is true. My comment regarding the 'new age ' movement was more of a sweeping surface generalization of the plethora of books and dvd's out there spewing forth the same recycled 'universal truths' and 'amazing transformations' of their adherents. I have for the past 20 years or so exposed myself to various new age ideologies, workshops, yogic schools, meditation schools as well as satanism, esoteric and left hand path ideologies so please understand that I'm not coming from a place of ignorance. I didn't mean to offend any 'serious' practitioner of the new age movement. I was referring to the larger portion of people who get into the spiritual for a short time and then forget about it, not looking any further, allowing all their books and trinkets to gather dust. I'll make sure to choose my words a little more carefully from now on. I appreciate your feedback, as it only helps me to improve. When the stars are right! K'ara Kaiul Esoteric Herald of the Old Gods Cult of Cthulhu
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