Post by Yahn'ikthorn on Mar 10, 2008 14:19:55 GMT -6
This thread is for discussing the Norse/Germanic concept of the End of the World and the subsequent New Beginning.
What does all of this mean from the Cultist perspective? Are the old gods to be replaced by the Old Ones?
I see Ragnarök as an extremely hopeful thing. What wonders will be born after this world of filth will have been burned to fertile ashes by Surtr's flames!
The following is directly from wikipedia in case somebody isn't aware of its existence:
In Norse mythology, Ragnarok or Ragnarök ("Fate of the Gods") is the final battle waged between the Æsir, led by Odin, and the various forces of the giants or Jötnar, including Loki, followed by the destruction of the world and its subsequent rebirth. Not only will most of the gods, giants and monsters involved perish in this apocalyptic conflagration, but almost everything in the universe will be torn asunder and destroyed.
In Viking warrior society, dying honorably in battle earned a man a place in Valhalla with the gods, on whose side he would fight during Ragnarök as one of the einhärjar. Dying of illness or old age was ignominious and earned a man an afterlife in Hel. In the Norse pantheon the gods themselves were doomed to die in battle at Ragnarök. Exactly what will happen, who will fight whom, and the fates of the participants in this battle were well known to the Norse peoples from the Sagas and skaldic poetry. The Völuspá ("Prophecy of the Völva") — the first lay of the Poetic Edda and dating from about A.D. 1000 — spans the history of the old gods, from the beginning of time to Ragnarok, in 65 stanzas. The Prose Edda, put in writing some two centuries later by Snorri Sturluson, describes in detail what takes place before, during, and after the battle.
What seems eschatologically unique about Ragnarök is that the gods know through prophecy what is going to happen — when the event will occur, who will be slain by whom, and so forth. They even realize that they are powerless to prevent it but nevertheless bravely and defiantly face their bleak destiny. This is thought by some scholars to represent the ordered world (the Æsir) eventually succumbing to the unavoidable forces of chaos and entropy (the giants).
Old Norse Ragnarök is a compound of ragna, the genitive plural of regin ("gods" or "ruling powers"), and rök "fate" (etymologically related to English "reach"). Ragnarøkkr is another form with a slightly different meaning, as "røkkr" means "twilight".
In Danish ragnarok is also used as a synonym for chaos.
Prelude
According to the Gylfaginning section of the Prose Edda the main events that signify the approach of Ragnarök include:
1. The birth of three beings — the offspring of Loki and the giantess Angrboda, namely Jörmungandr, Fenrir and Hel and the gods' subsequent actions to confine them.
2. The death of the god Baldr and the binding of Loki.
3. The onset of Fimbulvetr.
Portents
Ragnarök will be preceded by the Fimbulvetr or "Great Winter", a period of three years of perpetual winter with no summer between. Snow will fall from all directions with great frosts and biting wind, and the sun will lend no warmth to the earth. During this time great battles will be fought throughout the world, humanity will descend further into violence and depravity, laws of kinship will be broken, and fathers, sons and brothers will rise up against one another. According to Völuspá, it will be an "axe age, a sword age, shields are cleft asunder, a storm age, a wolf age, before the world plunges headlong."
The wolves Sköll and Hati will then finally devour Sól (the Sun) and her brother Máni (the Moon) respectively after a perpetual chase, and the stars will burn out and vanish from the sky, plunging the earth into darkness.
At that point Garmr, the monstrous hound that is bound at the cave of Gnipahellir, will begin to bay loudly. In response, three cockerels will begin crowing: Fjalar in Jotunheim from the forest of Gallows-wood, Gullinkambi in Valhalla who will wake the einherjar, and a third one that is not named, crowing in Hel and waking the dead. The giant Hraesvelgr will sit on the edge of the heavens in eagle form and shriek with anticipation.
The earth will begin to tremble so violently that trees will be uprooted and mountains will fall, and all bonds and fetters will snap and break. Loki, god of mischief and strife, will be freed along with his ferocious son, the wolf Fenrir whose slavering mouth will gape wide open with his upper jaw against the sky and his lower one against the earth, but it would gape even wider if there was room. Flames will burn from the wolf's eyes and leap from his nostrils. Likewise, Garmr's "rope will break and the ravener run free". Meanwhile, Eggthér, a herdsman among the giants, will sit on a mound and joyfully play his harp in grim celebration of the coming holocaust.
At the same time, the oceans will surge up, drowning the land in a great flood as Jörmungandr, the Midgard Serpent, twisting and writhing in fury, makes his way onto the shore. He will proceed alongside his brother Fenrir, spewing venom and spattering the sky and earth with his poison.
Then it will happen that in the upsurge of waters, the great ship Naglfar, the ship of the giants (which is made from the nails of the dead), will be released from its moorings in Jotunheim. Set free by the catastrophic flooding and tsunamis caused by the Serpent, it will be carried along from the east, captained by the giant Hrym and transporting the legions of Jotnar toward the battlefield of Vigrid (Óskópnir).
From the north will sail Loki in a ship carrying a great army of the dead ("Hel's people" according to Gylfaginning) to fight against the einherjar.
Amid this turmoil, the sky will open and from it will ride the fire giants of Muspelheim (the "sons of Muspell"), led by Surtr who brandishes a flaming sword ("burning with the sun of the war gods" according to Völuspá). They will advance from the south with fire before and behind them, tearing the sky apart as they too close in on Vigrid. As Surtr and the others ride over Bifröst, the rainbow bridge will break behind them and fall to the earth, while the mountains themselves crack open, releasing hordes of troll-wives upon the land.
All the forces of the Jotnar will thus arrive on three fronts to storm Asgard and will gather in battle formation upon Vigrid. They will all but fill that plain that stretches one hundred leagues in every direction.
Final battle
Heimdall, being the first of the gods to see the enemies approaching, will blow mightily on Gjallarhorn, sounding such a blast that it will be heard throughout all worlds. All the gods will awaken and at once meet in council. Odin will then mount his horse Sleipnir, ride to the well of Mímir and consult him for guidance on his own and his people's behalf.
Yggdrasil, the World Tree, will groan and shudder, shaking from root to limb, and nothing will then be unafraid on earth or in the heavens or in Hel. The dwarves, those "princes of the mountain wall", will lament before their doorways of stone. All the Æsir and einherjar will put on their war gear and advance onto the field to meet the giants. Odin will ride in front of the vast host wearing a golden helmet, a shining coat of mail and brandishing his spear Gungnir.
Odin will make straight for Fenrir, and Thor, right beside him, will be unable to help because his old enemy Jörmungandr, the Midgard Serpent, will at once attack him. Freyr, the "bright slayer of Beli", will fight the fire giant Surtr, but after a harsh conflict he will become the first of all the gods to fall as he has previously given his own good sword to his servant Skírnir. Tyr will battle Garmr and each will slay the other.
Thor, "the glorious son of Earth", will kill Jörmungandr with his hammer Mjolnir. "In his wrath the defender of Midgard strikes" but will himself stagger back nine steps before falling to the ground dead from the poison which the Serpent unleashed upon him. Then the "second sorrow of Frigg" will come about when Odin fights valiantly against Fenrir but is swallowed by the wolf. However, Odin's son Vidar will immediately advance against the "beast of slaughter" and step with one foot on the wolf's lower jaw. On this foot he will be wearing the heavy shoe which he has been making since the beginning of time, consisting of all the leather waste pieces which men pare off at the toes and heels of their own shoes. With one hand he will grasp the wolf's upper jaw and tear his mouth apart, killing him at last and avenging his father.
Finally, Heimdall will fight Loki but neither will survive the evenly matched encounter. With that, Surtr will raise his hand and unleash his flame over the earth and burn the entire world. The conflagration will leap high against the heavens, and Surtr himself will be consumed by his own fiery destruction along with the other giants and most other gods and beings in the process. The land will sink completely into the sea.
Aftermath and Rebirth
After a time when the fire of Surtr has died down and the smoke and steam are dispersed, a new earth will rise up from the sea. It will be green and fair, and crops and fields will grow on their own, without sowing. All ills will be healed. "A waterfall plunges, an eagle soars over it, hunting fish on the mountain." A daughter born to the sun goddess will continue her mother's solar journey across the sky. In a place called Hoddmimir's Forest a man and woman named Lif and Lifthrasir will have survived, finding refuge from the fire and nourishing themselves with morning dew. Together they will become the progenitors of a new race of humans and the world will be inhabited once again.
A few of the gods will also have survived the ordeal including Odin's sons Vidar and Váli, not having been harmed by the flames or the deluge, and they will dwell "in the temples of the gods" on the field of Idavoll where Asgard, now destroyed, had previously been. Thor's sons Magni and Modi, the inheritors of their father's hammer, will then arrive, bringing Mjolnir. Baldr and his brother Höd (who both died prior to Ragnarök) will be reborn, fully reconciled, and ascend from Hel to dwell in the former halls of their father Odin in the heavens. Hoenir will also be there and will "choose wooden slips for prophecy." The new generation of mortals will then worship this new pantheon of gods, led by Baldr, the legitimate heir of Odin.
Meeting at Idavoll, these gods will sit down together, discuss their mysteries and hidden lore, and speak of the things that had happened in former times, of the Midgard Serpent and Fenriswolf, and of "the ancient runes of Fimbultyr." Then they will find in the green grass the golden playing pieces that had belonged to the Æsir when the universe was young. They will behold these objects in wonder, tangible reminders of a first golden age of peace at the dawn of time.
There will still be many halls and mansions to house the souls of the dead, both of the righteous and the wicked. The best place to be in the heavens will be the hall of Gimlé, brighter than the sun with a roof of gold. "There the noble lords will live and spend their days in pleasure." There is also the hall of Brimir where there will be plenty of good drink for those who take pleasure in it and is located on the plain of Okolnir ("Never Cold"). That is also a good hall called Sindri, built of red gold and located on Nidafjoll ("Dark Mountains"). In these halls shall dwell good and virtuous people. There are also two other heavenly realms located above Asgard known as Andlang and Vidblain. These places will offer protection while Surtr's fire burns the world.
The fate of the wicked is not so pleasant. In Hel is located a hall of punishment in a region called Náströnd ("Corpse Shore"). The hall itself is not named in the Eddic sources but is large and woven from serpents like a wattled house. The heads of these snakes all face inward and spit venom so that rivers of poison flow along the hall, and floundering in these caustic streams are the souls of murderers, oathbreakers and seducers. The dragon Nidhogg will torment the bodies of the dead, and a wolf will tear at their corpses.
* * *
More information can be found from the Eddas.
The Poetic Edda:
www.sacred-texts.com/neu/poe/index.htm
The Prose Edda:
www.sacred-texts.com/neu/pre/index.htm
What do you think of all this?
What does all of this mean from the Cultist perspective? Are the old gods to be replaced by the Old Ones?
I see Ragnarök as an extremely hopeful thing. What wonders will be born after this world of filth will have been burned to fertile ashes by Surtr's flames!
The following is directly from wikipedia in case somebody isn't aware of its existence:
In Norse mythology, Ragnarok or Ragnarök ("Fate of the Gods") is the final battle waged between the Æsir, led by Odin, and the various forces of the giants or Jötnar, including Loki, followed by the destruction of the world and its subsequent rebirth. Not only will most of the gods, giants and monsters involved perish in this apocalyptic conflagration, but almost everything in the universe will be torn asunder and destroyed.
In Viking warrior society, dying honorably in battle earned a man a place in Valhalla with the gods, on whose side he would fight during Ragnarök as one of the einhärjar. Dying of illness or old age was ignominious and earned a man an afterlife in Hel. In the Norse pantheon the gods themselves were doomed to die in battle at Ragnarök. Exactly what will happen, who will fight whom, and the fates of the participants in this battle were well known to the Norse peoples from the Sagas and skaldic poetry. The Völuspá ("Prophecy of the Völva") — the first lay of the Poetic Edda and dating from about A.D. 1000 — spans the history of the old gods, from the beginning of time to Ragnarok, in 65 stanzas. The Prose Edda, put in writing some two centuries later by Snorri Sturluson, describes in detail what takes place before, during, and after the battle.
What seems eschatologically unique about Ragnarök is that the gods know through prophecy what is going to happen — when the event will occur, who will be slain by whom, and so forth. They even realize that they are powerless to prevent it but nevertheless bravely and defiantly face their bleak destiny. This is thought by some scholars to represent the ordered world (the Æsir) eventually succumbing to the unavoidable forces of chaos and entropy (the giants).
Old Norse Ragnarök is a compound of ragna, the genitive plural of regin ("gods" or "ruling powers"), and rök "fate" (etymologically related to English "reach"). Ragnarøkkr is another form with a slightly different meaning, as "røkkr" means "twilight".
In Danish ragnarok is also used as a synonym for chaos.
Prelude
According to the Gylfaginning section of the Prose Edda the main events that signify the approach of Ragnarök include:
1. The birth of three beings — the offspring of Loki and the giantess Angrboda, namely Jörmungandr, Fenrir and Hel and the gods' subsequent actions to confine them.
2. The death of the god Baldr and the binding of Loki.
3. The onset of Fimbulvetr.
Portents
Ragnarök will be preceded by the Fimbulvetr or "Great Winter", a period of three years of perpetual winter with no summer between. Snow will fall from all directions with great frosts and biting wind, and the sun will lend no warmth to the earth. During this time great battles will be fought throughout the world, humanity will descend further into violence and depravity, laws of kinship will be broken, and fathers, sons and brothers will rise up against one another. According to Völuspá, it will be an "axe age, a sword age, shields are cleft asunder, a storm age, a wolf age, before the world plunges headlong."
The wolves Sköll and Hati will then finally devour Sól (the Sun) and her brother Máni (the Moon) respectively after a perpetual chase, and the stars will burn out and vanish from the sky, plunging the earth into darkness.
At that point Garmr, the monstrous hound that is bound at the cave of Gnipahellir, will begin to bay loudly. In response, three cockerels will begin crowing: Fjalar in Jotunheim from the forest of Gallows-wood, Gullinkambi in Valhalla who will wake the einherjar, and a third one that is not named, crowing in Hel and waking the dead. The giant Hraesvelgr will sit on the edge of the heavens in eagle form and shriek with anticipation.
The earth will begin to tremble so violently that trees will be uprooted and mountains will fall, and all bonds and fetters will snap and break. Loki, god of mischief and strife, will be freed along with his ferocious son, the wolf Fenrir whose slavering mouth will gape wide open with his upper jaw against the sky and his lower one against the earth, but it would gape even wider if there was room. Flames will burn from the wolf's eyes and leap from his nostrils. Likewise, Garmr's "rope will break and the ravener run free". Meanwhile, Eggthér, a herdsman among the giants, will sit on a mound and joyfully play his harp in grim celebration of the coming holocaust.
At the same time, the oceans will surge up, drowning the land in a great flood as Jörmungandr, the Midgard Serpent, twisting and writhing in fury, makes his way onto the shore. He will proceed alongside his brother Fenrir, spewing venom and spattering the sky and earth with his poison.
Then it will happen that in the upsurge of waters, the great ship Naglfar, the ship of the giants (which is made from the nails of the dead), will be released from its moorings in Jotunheim. Set free by the catastrophic flooding and tsunamis caused by the Serpent, it will be carried along from the east, captained by the giant Hrym and transporting the legions of Jotnar toward the battlefield of Vigrid (Óskópnir).
From the north will sail Loki in a ship carrying a great army of the dead ("Hel's people" according to Gylfaginning) to fight against the einherjar.
Amid this turmoil, the sky will open and from it will ride the fire giants of Muspelheim (the "sons of Muspell"), led by Surtr who brandishes a flaming sword ("burning with the sun of the war gods" according to Völuspá). They will advance from the south with fire before and behind them, tearing the sky apart as they too close in on Vigrid. As Surtr and the others ride over Bifröst, the rainbow bridge will break behind them and fall to the earth, while the mountains themselves crack open, releasing hordes of troll-wives upon the land.
All the forces of the Jotnar will thus arrive on three fronts to storm Asgard and will gather in battle formation upon Vigrid. They will all but fill that plain that stretches one hundred leagues in every direction.
Final battle
Heimdall, being the first of the gods to see the enemies approaching, will blow mightily on Gjallarhorn, sounding such a blast that it will be heard throughout all worlds. All the gods will awaken and at once meet in council. Odin will then mount his horse Sleipnir, ride to the well of Mímir and consult him for guidance on his own and his people's behalf.
Yggdrasil, the World Tree, will groan and shudder, shaking from root to limb, and nothing will then be unafraid on earth or in the heavens or in Hel. The dwarves, those "princes of the mountain wall", will lament before their doorways of stone. All the Æsir and einherjar will put on their war gear and advance onto the field to meet the giants. Odin will ride in front of the vast host wearing a golden helmet, a shining coat of mail and brandishing his spear Gungnir.
Odin will make straight for Fenrir, and Thor, right beside him, will be unable to help because his old enemy Jörmungandr, the Midgard Serpent, will at once attack him. Freyr, the "bright slayer of Beli", will fight the fire giant Surtr, but after a harsh conflict he will become the first of all the gods to fall as he has previously given his own good sword to his servant Skírnir. Tyr will battle Garmr and each will slay the other.
Thor, "the glorious son of Earth", will kill Jörmungandr with his hammer Mjolnir. "In his wrath the defender of Midgard strikes" but will himself stagger back nine steps before falling to the ground dead from the poison which the Serpent unleashed upon him. Then the "second sorrow of Frigg" will come about when Odin fights valiantly against Fenrir but is swallowed by the wolf. However, Odin's son Vidar will immediately advance against the "beast of slaughter" and step with one foot on the wolf's lower jaw. On this foot he will be wearing the heavy shoe which he has been making since the beginning of time, consisting of all the leather waste pieces which men pare off at the toes and heels of their own shoes. With one hand he will grasp the wolf's upper jaw and tear his mouth apart, killing him at last and avenging his father.
Finally, Heimdall will fight Loki but neither will survive the evenly matched encounter. With that, Surtr will raise his hand and unleash his flame over the earth and burn the entire world. The conflagration will leap high against the heavens, and Surtr himself will be consumed by his own fiery destruction along with the other giants and most other gods and beings in the process. The land will sink completely into the sea.
Aftermath and Rebirth
After a time when the fire of Surtr has died down and the smoke and steam are dispersed, a new earth will rise up from the sea. It will be green and fair, and crops and fields will grow on their own, without sowing. All ills will be healed. "A waterfall plunges, an eagle soars over it, hunting fish on the mountain." A daughter born to the sun goddess will continue her mother's solar journey across the sky. In a place called Hoddmimir's Forest a man and woman named Lif and Lifthrasir will have survived, finding refuge from the fire and nourishing themselves with morning dew. Together they will become the progenitors of a new race of humans and the world will be inhabited once again.
A few of the gods will also have survived the ordeal including Odin's sons Vidar and Váli, not having been harmed by the flames or the deluge, and they will dwell "in the temples of the gods" on the field of Idavoll where Asgard, now destroyed, had previously been. Thor's sons Magni and Modi, the inheritors of their father's hammer, will then arrive, bringing Mjolnir. Baldr and his brother Höd (who both died prior to Ragnarök) will be reborn, fully reconciled, and ascend from Hel to dwell in the former halls of their father Odin in the heavens. Hoenir will also be there and will "choose wooden slips for prophecy." The new generation of mortals will then worship this new pantheon of gods, led by Baldr, the legitimate heir of Odin.
Meeting at Idavoll, these gods will sit down together, discuss their mysteries and hidden lore, and speak of the things that had happened in former times, of the Midgard Serpent and Fenriswolf, and of "the ancient runes of Fimbultyr." Then they will find in the green grass the golden playing pieces that had belonged to the Æsir when the universe was young. They will behold these objects in wonder, tangible reminders of a first golden age of peace at the dawn of time.
There will still be many halls and mansions to house the souls of the dead, both of the righteous and the wicked. The best place to be in the heavens will be the hall of Gimlé, brighter than the sun with a roof of gold. "There the noble lords will live and spend their days in pleasure." There is also the hall of Brimir where there will be plenty of good drink for those who take pleasure in it and is located on the plain of Okolnir ("Never Cold"). That is also a good hall called Sindri, built of red gold and located on Nidafjoll ("Dark Mountains"). In these halls shall dwell good and virtuous people. There are also two other heavenly realms located above Asgard known as Andlang and Vidblain. These places will offer protection while Surtr's fire burns the world.
The fate of the wicked is not so pleasant. In Hel is located a hall of punishment in a region called Náströnd ("Corpse Shore"). The hall itself is not named in the Eddic sources but is large and woven from serpents like a wattled house. The heads of these snakes all face inward and spit venom so that rivers of poison flow along the hall, and floundering in these caustic streams are the souls of murderers, oathbreakers and seducers. The dragon Nidhogg will torment the bodies of the dead, and a wolf will tear at their corpses.
* * *
More information can be found from the Eddas.
The Poetic Edda:
www.sacred-texts.com/neu/poe/index.htm
The Prose Edda:
www.sacred-texts.com/neu/pre/index.htm
What do you think of all this?