Post by nyarlathotep2007 on Mar 1, 2008 8:02:15 GMT -6
Based on my study into Magic-Science (AKA Practical/Physical/Lab Alchemy), I have deduced that the Old Ones may have used science as per the recipe known as "The Making of the Space-Meade" in "The Yellow Necronomicon" which falls in the category of ethno-botany. Would it be ok for the group to practice Alchemy/Magic-Science in a sense of combining science with potion-making if I posted research into potion-making that is combined with Alchemy (a.k.a. Plant Alchemy and Water Alchemy, which uses Distillation to make tinctures/mortars)?
A Comparison of Alchemy and the Old Ones as a chart.
1.) The Oroborus - Tiamat - Re-incarnation, decay of the body and being born.
2.) Earth - Half of Tiamat - The Center of Life and the Universe.
3.) Philosophical Planets - The Zonei (Old Ones) - In Sumer and Babylon, the planets was the Gods. Star and planet-worship was
BIG in those days. Hence the obsession with Astrology and Astronomy in the ancient world.
4.) Chaos - Azathoth - Source of un-balance and disorder.
5.) Creation - Ubbo-Sathla - Old One that is the source of all things, whether physical, spiritual, earthly, or of space.
6.) Degrees - Yog-Sothoth - Guardian/Master of the Levels of Time and Space.
7.) Catalyst - Nyarlathotep - Enforcer of Change.
8.) Transmutation - Cthulhu - Cause of Change, High Priest of the Old Ones, Ruler of R'lyeh.
9.) Element - Yuggoth - Thing To Be Changed.
1.) At least two years in Philosophy.
2.) At least a "C" average in High School Biology.
3.) At least six month's interest in Astrology concerning the philosophy and symbols of the zodiac and the planetary glyphs of Alchemy which are Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, and Saturn. Not to mention Sol and Luna.
4.) A general understanding of the Kabbalah concerning the creation epic.
5.) And a deep understanding of Gnostic Christainity (the documents concerning the impurity of the physical world and the concepts concerning awakening the inner god).
6.) Has to believe in re-incarnation. What religous concept of it does not matter, although re-incarnation from an Occult stance is preferred.
7.) Having an old, but thick and detailed dictionary.
8.) And having connections to symbolism. Having a website on the colors, animals, and things of symbolism in your favorites is really good for this.
2.) When collected in a sufficient quantity, and violently agitated (in starting a fire, this would be the step of gathering the materials to burn and then using a lighter) into burning fire. This continues burning as long as it is agitated, and has a fit subject to act upon, when that fails, it returns to its first degree. In which case, it becomes live embers, only generating heat and light, not fire.
a.) We say in its first most Universal state it is perfectly invisible and immaterial.
b.) In its second state of manifestation (see second degree) it is visible as light, but remains cold and immaterial (spiritual).
c.) In its third state of heat, burning fire is visible, hot, burning, and becomes somewhat material as it occupies room (or space) whilst in this state.
The fourth degree, is nothing more than the removal of the Quintessence (soul of something that is non-human, non-animal, nor a familar spirit, such as nature itself). One example in nature where man removes the quintessance of something, is when cutting down a tree, as the tree is seperated from nature and can no longer recieve nourishment from the ground or rain. To a Buddhist, this would be the concept of "killing" a re-incarnated ancestor that has become an insect or part of the plant kingdom.
3.) These are the degrees (levels) that apply to the elements of nature in lab Alchemy (Earth, Fire, Wind, and Water, yes....I'm more black earth (the land of the dead) than anything. These degrees are taken from the Golden Chain of Homer.
1.) In its original, most universal state, it is perfectly invisible, immaterial, cold, and occupies no space, in this tranquil state it is of no use to us, yet in this un-moved state it is omnipresent (spiritually everywhere at once).
2.) In its second state it is manifested by motion or agitation into light [such as grinding two rocks together to generate fire (in Alchemy, everything comes from chaos, then fire, then water, then earth, in that order)].
1.) Transmutation circles just represent an Occult idea such as infinite knowledge (a mountain without a base inside a single circle). On another note, the only "REAL" one I seen I just described.
2.) Oroborus symbolizes the belief in re-incarnation (not to exlcude a physical overview as to what happens to the body upon death and being born).
3.) Ancient Gnostics believed that the creation gods was impure, as well as the physical world, which this belief is shared in Magic-Science (Alchemy).
4.) This also includes Astrology in the sense of the zodiac and the philosophical planets (Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, the Sun (called Sol), and the Moon (called Luna). Which, anyone who has read "The Gates of the Necronomicon" would know that these are tied in with the Ladder of Lights (Walking of the Gates of the Zonei).
5.) The Gnostic concepts include the belief that "God is within us all (i.e. One is all, and all is one)", and that the creation gods, not to mention the physical world, is impure.
6.) The Kabbalah has ties to Magic-Science in the sense of the concept of Chaos and that this is not the first world made in the universe (physically), but spiritually (is the favorite of all creation to "God, the Source, or in this case, Cthulhu.)"
7.) That the Earth is the center of the universe (spiritually and philosophically speaking, which all of the ancient masters of the Occult in the pre-Christ era believed this, and it ties with the Necronomicon, according to Simon in "The Gates of the Necronomicon).
8.) That Chaos is the source of all things, living, dead, and in-animate on this planet.
9.) Also Includes Metaphysics (Spiritual Alchemy) and Psychic Phenomenon.
10.) Basically the entire Occult except for RHP Worship, Voodoo, and Divination (with the exception of I'Ching).
BTW, Dee's Research Necronomicon is called "The Yellow Necronomicon". If you wanna know how to get it, e-mail me at chaos_stirred@yahoo.com. Here is the recipe he gave for Astral Travel in the LHP. This should not shock fellow cultists too much as the LHP, in some aspects, does use drugs and plants to accomplish some ends.
"The Making Of The Space-Meade" - A faithful interpretation of the recipe.....
This is used for Astral Travel as it deceives the waking mind into thinking that the body has just accomplished the requirements for Astral Projection and the soul, as well as the sub-conscious mind, acts accordingly.
1.) Thou must first grind in mortar (for info on mortar production, research the process of tincture-making as mortar is another name for a tincture) 150 grams of ye seed of the morning glory plant.
Just get 150 grams worth of the seed of the morning glory flower.
2.) In 130 cc. of petroleum ether, soack the seeds for the span of two days.
One cc. is equal to one unit on a needle (from one line to the next). Petroleum ether is also known as benzine, X4, or Ligroin and is only toxic if eaten directly. Although, since benzine is a toxic substance, caution should be shown anyway when using it.
3.) Then thou must filter the solution through a tight screen. For the span of two more days, allow the mush to soak again in 110cc. of wooden alcohol.
Wooden alcohol is also known as ethanol, which is used to make wine.
4.) Filter the solution again, as above, Yet thou must save this liquid and Thou must now label it as "Solution ALPHA".
Just repeat the filtering process and filter the liquid into a flask and label is "Solution ALPHA".
5.) Resoak the mush in 110cc. of wooden alcohol for yet two days more. Filter again, yet this time throw away the mush.
Add the liquid from the second soaking of the mush to the solution thou hast labeled as "Solution ALPHA". Yet this time, through away the mush.
Just resoak the mush in 110cc. of grape wine for two more days. Filter the liquid again into another flask and throw away the mush. Then combine the liquid from this soaking to "Solution ALPHA".
6.) Now doth thou pour the alchemical liquid into thy condensation tray and allow it to evaporate therefrom. When yet all of the liquid hath evaporated, a golden resin (resin = another name for the sap from a plant, AKA gum). This should be scraped up and stored as thou want. 30 grams of this meade should thus be ingested to provide flight unto the Aethers.
Just pour the liquid into a tray that has been designed to cause the liquid to become a solid (thus dubbed in modern science and Alchemy as a condensation tray. The tray would be on top of a burner that would condense it into a solid).
Now you understand my interest in combining Sorcery with Alchemy.....lol
Transmutation circles was never used in an Occult sense of clapping hands and then something changing into something else. The only transmutation circle I've come across that is not from that stupid anime (Full-Metal Alchemist) is a single circle with a mountain in it without a base line. According to Occult symbolism and theology, it is symbolic of the circle being infinite and the mountain representing knowledge. So this circle represents the idea of infinite knowledge (i.e. enlightenment).
What is everyone's take on Lab Alchemy and if you could work with it, woud you? Transmutation Circles was just used to represent an idea or the formula of a compound. Clapping your hands together and praying for something to change in the physical world in the sense of metals, minerals, and elements is a joke when talking about a physical transmutation (means to change, would be synonymous with the word "Morph" or "Metamorphosis"). As for transmuting base metals into gold, I'll believe it when I see it. I'm not referring to Spiritual Alchemy (One is All, All is One....). Both groups of Alchemists did believe that the natural (physical) world was impure, and that man was impure for being born into it, which is actually an idea from Gnosticism. And they also believed in re-incarnation. It would not alter the CoC in any form since its core beliefs already revolve around those that line up with Alchemy. They also believed that by copying the processes of nature (distillation, dissolution, coagulation, etc.), a person could change metals and minerals, just like nature does in the physical world, which scientists do to an extent. You wouldn't have to have an PhD in Physics to understand it, but at least a "C" in Biology would help. Most of the documents compare an element's transformations by processes, colors, and degrees. Which, I understand those easily. Five books a person should read on Lab Alchemy before continuing into the subject is "Frater Albertus - The Alchemist's Handbook (All Three English Editions)", "The Golden Chain of Homer (Goes over the degrees of the elements of nature)", and "A Form And Method Of Perfecting Base Metals (It goes over how Chaos can change through different processes, some of which are physical, and others are spiritual." BTW, some of the experiments do involve ceremonial magick because of its nature, such as the Homunculus (a familiar spirit that is less powerful than a human soul, but is also part of the lab). I currently have a ritual based on the Necronomicon. A Sorcerer who served the Old Ones could use it to make a Shuggoth, but an Alchemist could also use it to make a Homunculus, as both us the same methods to create them. On another note, creating a Shuggoth/Homunculus is a solitary sex ritual that revolves around men (sorry ladies....I've never heard of a female Alchemist, on another note, women can participate in creating a "group Shuggoth"). The word Shuggoth comes from the Sumerian root word, Shaggai, which means "to fornicate". The purposes of a Shuggoth has the same effects a Polter-geist would have, but is of a sexual nature and relies on that topic (no, not rape, more like when Anna Nicole Smith said she had a "ghost" under her sheets with her...)"
For the ritual to create a Shuggoth, go to www.chaosmatrix.org/library/chaos/rites/shoggoth.html.
Shuggoth [Etymological Definition] - A familiar spiriit that is created through sex rituals of those that worship the Old Ones and is used for "nightly visits".
Homunculus {pl. Homunculi} -
1. an artificially made dwarf, supposedly produced in a flask by an alchemist.
2. A familiar spirit that is similar to a dwarf (without the beard), and is part of the Alchemy Lab that assists the Alchemist in his operations (Compare to Def. #1).
Anyone that is interested in further info about the Homunculus can contact me at chaos_stirred@yahoo.com
Yes, I have had six years of research into Alchemy. I also understand the first three sections of "Treasure of Treasures of the Alchemists" By Paracelsus that tells how to make the Philosopher's Stone (physically, not spiritually). If I type it up as a post, it will be in outline format so everyone can understand it. More or less, its a detailed outline on how to forge the stone because some of the steps are accurate (just un-savory to the stomach). BTW, the ritual for creating the Shuggoth at that link has nothing to do with Alchemy, other than the fact that the method for creating a Homunculus has the ideas behind them that are similar.
[i've condensed all your alchemy stuff into just one thread. starting 8 new threads to deal with each variation doesn't make any sense... especially since the topic will most likely be ignored. VS]
A Comparison of Alchemy and the Old Ones as a chart.
1.) The Oroborus - Tiamat - Re-incarnation, decay of the body and being born.
2.) Earth - Half of Tiamat - The Center of Life and the Universe.
3.) Philosophical Planets - The Zonei (Old Ones) - In Sumer and Babylon, the planets was the Gods. Star and planet-worship was
BIG in those days. Hence the obsession with Astrology and Astronomy in the ancient world.
4.) Chaos - Azathoth - Source of un-balance and disorder.
5.) Creation - Ubbo-Sathla - Old One that is the source of all things, whether physical, spiritual, earthly, or of space.
6.) Degrees - Yog-Sothoth - Guardian/Master of the Levels of Time and Space.
7.) Catalyst - Nyarlathotep - Enforcer of Change.
8.) Transmutation - Cthulhu - Cause of Change, High Priest of the Old Ones, Ruler of R'lyeh.
9.) Element - Yuggoth - Thing To Be Changed.
1.) At least two years in Philosophy.
2.) At least a "C" average in High School Biology.
3.) At least six month's interest in Astrology concerning the philosophy and symbols of the zodiac and the planetary glyphs of Alchemy which are Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, and Saturn. Not to mention Sol and Luna.
4.) A general understanding of the Kabbalah concerning the creation epic.
5.) And a deep understanding of Gnostic Christainity (the documents concerning the impurity of the physical world and the concepts concerning awakening the inner god).
6.) Has to believe in re-incarnation. What religous concept of it does not matter, although re-incarnation from an Occult stance is preferred.
7.) Having an old, but thick and detailed dictionary.
8.) And having connections to symbolism. Having a website on the colors, animals, and things of symbolism in your favorites is really good for this.
2.) When collected in a sufficient quantity, and violently agitated (in starting a fire, this would be the step of gathering the materials to burn and then using a lighter) into burning fire. This continues burning as long as it is agitated, and has a fit subject to act upon, when that fails, it returns to its first degree. In which case, it becomes live embers, only generating heat and light, not fire.
a.) We say in its first most Universal state it is perfectly invisible and immaterial.
b.) In its second state of manifestation (see second degree) it is visible as light, but remains cold and immaterial (spiritual).
c.) In its third state of heat, burning fire is visible, hot, burning, and becomes somewhat material as it occupies room (or space) whilst in this state.
The fourth degree, is nothing more than the removal of the Quintessence (soul of something that is non-human, non-animal, nor a familar spirit, such as nature itself). One example in nature where man removes the quintessance of something, is when cutting down a tree, as the tree is seperated from nature and can no longer recieve nourishment from the ground or rain. To a Buddhist, this would be the concept of "killing" a re-incarnated ancestor that has become an insect or part of the plant kingdom.
3.) These are the degrees (levels) that apply to the elements of nature in lab Alchemy (Earth, Fire, Wind, and Water, yes....I'm more black earth (the land of the dead) than anything. These degrees are taken from the Golden Chain of Homer.
1.) In its original, most universal state, it is perfectly invisible, immaterial, cold, and occupies no space, in this tranquil state it is of no use to us, yet in this un-moved state it is omnipresent (spiritually everywhere at once).
2.) In its second state it is manifested by motion or agitation into light [such as grinding two rocks together to generate fire (in Alchemy, everything comes from chaos, then fire, then water, then earth, in that order)].
1.) Transmutation circles just represent an Occult idea such as infinite knowledge (a mountain without a base inside a single circle). On another note, the only "REAL" one I seen I just described.
2.) Oroborus symbolizes the belief in re-incarnation (not to exlcude a physical overview as to what happens to the body upon death and being born).
3.) Ancient Gnostics believed that the creation gods was impure, as well as the physical world, which this belief is shared in Magic-Science (Alchemy).
4.) This also includes Astrology in the sense of the zodiac and the philosophical planets (Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, the Sun (called Sol), and the Moon (called Luna). Which, anyone who has read "The Gates of the Necronomicon" would know that these are tied in with the Ladder of Lights (Walking of the Gates of the Zonei).
5.) The Gnostic concepts include the belief that "God is within us all (i.e. One is all, and all is one)", and that the creation gods, not to mention the physical world, is impure.
6.) The Kabbalah has ties to Magic-Science in the sense of the concept of Chaos and that this is not the first world made in the universe (physically), but spiritually (is the favorite of all creation to "God, the Source, or in this case, Cthulhu.)"
7.) That the Earth is the center of the universe (spiritually and philosophically speaking, which all of the ancient masters of the Occult in the pre-Christ era believed this, and it ties with the Necronomicon, according to Simon in "The Gates of the Necronomicon).
8.) That Chaos is the source of all things, living, dead, and in-animate on this planet.
9.) Also Includes Metaphysics (Spiritual Alchemy) and Psychic Phenomenon.
10.) Basically the entire Occult except for RHP Worship, Voodoo, and Divination (with the exception of I'Ching).
BTW, Dee's Research Necronomicon is called "The Yellow Necronomicon". If you wanna know how to get it, e-mail me at chaos_stirred@yahoo.com. Here is the recipe he gave for Astral Travel in the LHP. This should not shock fellow cultists too much as the LHP, in some aspects, does use drugs and plants to accomplish some ends.
"The Making Of The Space-Meade" - A faithful interpretation of the recipe.....
This is used for Astral Travel as it deceives the waking mind into thinking that the body has just accomplished the requirements for Astral Projection and the soul, as well as the sub-conscious mind, acts accordingly.
1.) Thou must first grind in mortar (for info on mortar production, research the process of tincture-making as mortar is another name for a tincture) 150 grams of ye seed of the morning glory plant.
Just get 150 grams worth of the seed of the morning glory flower.
2.) In 130 cc. of petroleum ether, soack the seeds for the span of two days.
One cc. is equal to one unit on a needle (from one line to the next). Petroleum ether is also known as benzine, X4, or Ligroin and is only toxic if eaten directly. Although, since benzine is a toxic substance, caution should be shown anyway when using it.
3.) Then thou must filter the solution through a tight screen. For the span of two more days, allow the mush to soak again in 110cc. of wooden alcohol.
Wooden alcohol is also known as ethanol, which is used to make wine.
4.) Filter the solution again, as above, Yet thou must save this liquid and Thou must now label it as "Solution ALPHA".
Just repeat the filtering process and filter the liquid into a flask and label is "Solution ALPHA".
5.) Resoak the mush in 110cc. of wooden alcohol for yet two days more. Filter again, yet this time throw away the mush.
Add the liquid from the second soaking of the mush to the solution thou hast labeled as "Solution ALPHA". Yet this time, through away the mush.
Just resoak the mush in 110cc. of grape wine for two more days. Filter the liquid again into another flask and throw away the mush. Then combine the liquid from this soaking to "Solution ALPHA".
6.) Now doth thou pour the alchemical liquid into thy condensation tray and allow it to evaporate therefrom. When yet all of the liquid hath evaporated, a golden resin (resin = another name for the sap from a plant, AKA gum). This should be scraped up and stored as thou want. 30 grams of this meade should thus be ingested to provide flight unto the Aethers.
Just pour the liquid into a tray that has been designed to cause the liquid to become a solid (thus dubbed in modern science and Alchemy as a condensation tray. The tray would be on top of a burner that would condense it into a solid).
Now you understand my interest in combining Sorcery with Alchemy.....lol
Transmutation circles was never used in an Occult sense of clapping hands and then something changing into something else. The only transmutation circle I've come across that is not from that stupid anime (Full-Metal Alchemist) is a single circle with a mountain in it without a base line. According to Occult symbolism and theology, it is symbolic of the circle being infinite and the mountain representing knowledge. So this circle represents the idea of infinite knowledge (i.e. enlightenment).
What is everyone's take on Lab Alchemy and if you could work with it, woud you? Transmutation Circles was just used to represent an idea or the formula of a compound. Clapping your hands together and praying for something to change in the physical world in the sense of metals, minerals, and elements is a joke when talking about a physical transmutation (means to change, would be synonymous with the word "Morph" or "Metamorphosis"). As for transmuting base metals into gold, I'll believe it when I see it. I'm not referring to Spiritual Alchemy (One is All, All is One....). Both groups of Alchemists did believe that the natural (physical) world was impure, and that man was impure for being born into it, which is actually an idea from Gnosticism. And they also believed in re-incarnation. It would not alter the CoC in any form since its core beliefs already revolve around those that line up with Alchemy. They also believed that by copying the processes of nature (distillation, dissolution, coagulation, etc.), a person could change metals and minerals, just like nature does in the physical world, which scientists do to an extent. You wouldn't have to have an PhD in Physics to understand it, but at least a "C" in Biology would help. Most of the documents compare an element's transformations by processes, colors, and degrees. Which, I understand those easily. Five books a person should read on Lab Alchemy before continuing into the subject is "Frater Albertus - The Alchemist's Handbook (All Three English Editions)", "The Golden Chain of Homer (Goes over the degrees of the elements of nature)", and "A Form And Method Of Perfecting Base Metals (It goes over how Chaos can change through different processes, some of which are physical, and others are spiritual." BTW, some of the experiments do involve ceremonial magick because of its nature, such as the Homunculus (a familiar spirit that is less powerful than a human soul, but is also part of the lab). I currently have a ritual based on the Necronomicon. A Sorcerer who served the Old Ones could use it to make a Shuggoth, but an Alchemist could also use it to make a Homunculus, as both us the same methods to create them. On another note, creating a Shuggoth/Homunculus is a solitary sex ritual that revolves around men (sorry ladies....I've never heard of a female Alchemist, on another note, women can participate in creating a "group Shuggoth"). The word Shuggoth comes from the Sumerian root word, Shaggai, which means "to fornicate". The purposes of a Shuggoth has the same effects a Polter-geist would have, but is of a sexual nature and relies on that topic (no, not rape, more like when Anna Nicole Smith said she had a "ghost" under her sheets with her...)"
For the ritual to create a Shuggoth, go to www.chaosmatrix.org/library/chaos/rites/shoggoth.html.
Shuggoth [Etymological Definition] - A familiar spiriit that is created through sex rituals of those that worship the Old Ones and is used for "nightly visits".
Homunculus {pl. Homunculi} -
1. an artificially made dwarf, supposedly produced in a flask by an alchemist.
2. A familiar spirit that is similar to a dwarf (without the beard), and is part of the Alchemy Lab that assists the Alchemist in his operations (Compare to Def. #1).
Anyone that is interested in further info about the Homunculus can contact me at chaos_stirred@yahoo.com
Yes, I have had six years of research into Alchemy. I also understand the first three sections of "Treasure of Treasures of the Alchemists" By Paracelsus that tells how to make the Philosopher's Stone (physically, not spiritually). If I type it up as a post, it will be in outline format so everyone can understand it. More or less, its a detailed outline on how to forge the stone because some of the steps are accurate (just un-savory to the stomach). BTW, the ritual for creating the Shuggoth at that link has nothing to do with Alchemy, other than the fact that the method for creating a Homunculus has the ideas behind them that are similar.
[i've condensed all your alchemy stuff into just one thread. starting 8 new threads to deal with each variation doesn't make any sense... especially since the topic will most likely be ignored. VS]