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Post by lokidreaming on Aug 20, 2012 19:39:01 GMT -6
I know what I need to know to do truly be an adept as a student of The Fourth Way. In order to truly grasp and understand and be a true adept, I have to only do Fourth Way work and sacrifice other paths I am on which also includes the COC. But, at this current time of my development and point in my life, I cannot make those sacrifices the Fourth Way path is demanding of me. One of the main objectives of the Fourth Way is also one of my main objectives and The Fourth Way only represents one road/path to the same end objectives that I desire to attain and achieve. This doesn’t mean I am going to stop be a student of The Fourth Way, it just means that I way not achieve the adeptness/completeness that I should and I am at piece with that. COC? I am part of the furniture and am here to stay. On the other hand I suspect that I be going the long way round, so for those who have managed to reconcile the separate demands of The Fourth Way and LHP Path and/or COC Paradigm and/or other paths, I am now asking for official help and guidance in this area. Had this conclusion/assumption due to watching a documentary on Gurdjieffs mission to spread his knowledge to the west and the parts about ouspenskys struggles with G which ended up with him nicol and bennett leaving G, I knew those three had made a mistake and realized how much more I needed to embrace/submit to the fourth way currents.
Also I watched Meetings With Remarkable Men, in which it reinforced my assumptions that one may need to go away from the group or path to accumulate more experience and knowledge, so when they do come back, they are ready to understand, I related this to the Prodigal Son Parable which I related back to G teaching style and how it is very relevant, and these links also is what I wanted to express in the COC, and how that it is ok to leave and come back.
What say you?
Belief IS Reality Loki Dreaming
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Post by lokidreaming on Aug 20, 2012 20:43:05 GMT -6
Due to the changes I have made, I feel a calm serenity inside, which I have never felt so intensely and wonderfully before.
I do not know what this means.
I feel like I am at the stage of a seekers path where they are at the beginning stages of being nearly done comparing and taking notes of all the possible paths and then going what next?
LD
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Post by Cain Da'arnesh on Aug 20, 2012 23:31:45 GMT -6
There is no need for reconciliation actually. It's best to kind of let them blend together. And what to do when they contradict each other? That's what free will is for my friend! And a BIG part of the LHP is the exercising of that free will. So I guess with that in mind, you can build a ziggurat. The first tier is the LHP itself as that is the basis for all that is to come next. The second tier is Satanism as that opens up MANY new pathways for you to work through and decide for yourself what is right and works for you and what should be thrown out. (Be decisive here brother!) The third tier is the CoC as that enables you to interact with other cultists in order to find what clicks and what should probably be evaluated. I say probably here because above all else, you need to remember that this is about YOU! And what may be fine for me might not be good for yourself! The fourth and final tier is the fourth way as this is your desired level of attainment. There are two things you must know about this tier. The first is that it cannot be reached without work and sacrifice. Although I would strongly advise careful consideration regarding the latter phrase (sacrifice) as you do not want to throw out anything you may need later! And the second is that you cannot have a zigguratt without a firm base and as such, you will need to hold on to the things that brought you there, even if you only visit them occasionally. Good luck on your quest and I wish you well!
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Post by sin on Aug 21, 2012 7:12:01 GMT -6
I'll continue to read these posts but before I make comment regarding the content spread across (3) networks now by my count, Loki Dreaming:
What does this provide you? You seem to be a constant state of flux, offering excuses for unfulfilled personal obligations and responsibilities and vying for either acceptance or acknowledgement. I've not seen much change or growth in your habits in the last couple of years and it really makes me wonder what this is all really about for you?
CS
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Post by lokidreaming on Aug 21, 2012 20:35:18 GMT -6
@ CS
Reason why I posted it on here was I interpreted VS response as to stick it on here.
Yes, I am in a constant state of flux, due to certain frustrations that I am trying hard to resolve.
I was/am well aware that my lack of progress and state of fluxes would not be viewed positively by the COC; I have known this for a long time.
Vying for acknowledgement and acceptance? Not that I know of. If it does come across like that I am, I apologize.
I know I have changed in the last few years; slowly but painfully.
What is this all about for me? I know what it is all about for me, but not sure in what context you meant so am hesitant to answer this until I get a better clarity by what you mean ie, as a member of COC, LHP, life in general etc.
LD
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Post by lokidreaming on Aug 21, 2012 21:37:46 GMT -6
One of the main frustration/hurdle for me which is why I am in a constant state of flux is due to the other persons expectations and their need for me to prove myself to them, they say that I do not need to prove myself to them and just be, yet I know they are not being truthful to me regarding this as everyone wants the other person to prove themselves to them in one way or another as everyone has standards they measure progress and such stuff by.
I know I do and I know this can be confused with judging people. So when people say you do not need to prove yourself and just be, I am like hmmmm...tick tock...tick tock....
In every situation in my life I know what is expected of me, but chose not to prove myself the way they want, instead I try another way to prove myself and try and meet the other person half way.
I have been struggling with am I being eternally stubborn or are they being eternally untruthful.
I knew in the past year or so I have been too stubborn and have been working on ways not to be, this is continuous process of trial and error as each situation is different to the other.
Guessing this post will also be considered an excuse and not an explanation.
LD
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Post by sin on Aug 21, 2012 22:43:40 GMT -6
@ CS Reason why I posted it on here was I interpreted VS response as to stick it on here. Which response is that, in regard to the books?
Perhaps it might help if you determine your pathology which leads to these frustrations and fluctuations which seem to be rather frequent.
This is merely my observation. I don't believe there is a consensus by all the cultists on this issue. I am not asking for your apology. I am asking you to reflect on this and your most recent posts for the last 30 days. This should always be about you and your personal development and growth.
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Post by I AM the Way on Aug 22, 2012 8:05:25 GMT -6
One of the main frustration/hurdle for me which is why I am in a constant state of flux is due to the other persons expectations and their need for me to prove myself to them, they say that I do not need to prove myself to them and just be, yet I know they are not being truthful to me regarding this as everyone wants the other person to prove themselves to them in one way or another as everyone has standards they measure progress and such stuff by. I know I do and I know this can be confused with judging people. So when people say you do not need to prove yourself and just be, I am like hmmmm...tick tock...tick tock.... In every situation in my life I know what is expected of me, but chose not to prove myself the way they want, instead I try another way to prove myself and try and meet the other person half way. I have been struggling with am I being eternally stubborn or are they being eternally untruthful. I knew in the past year or so I have been too stubborn and have been working on ways not to be, this is continuous process of trial and error as each situation is different to the other. Guessing this post will also be considered an excuse and not an explanation. LD It's hard to beat NLP when it comes to re-conditioning oneself. Say this to yourself 7 times a day, every day: "There is no need to prove myself to anyone."
Your need for approval is most likely related to your chief feature - the primary reason one has difficulty Awaking. I guarantee that if you repeat that sentence aloud 7 times a day for a month, it will help resolve your inner conflict.
By His loathsome tentacles,
VS
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Post by sin on Aug 22, 2012 9:39:40 GMT -6
Seeking acceptance is slavery.
When the stars are right...
CS
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Post by shawnhartnell on Aug 22, 2012 14:33:00 GMT -6
I don't have any expectations. I appreciate when you're here and telling me to clarify what I write, but no expectations that you should do so.
I don't expect you to prove anything to me. I mean, seriously, I'm not giving you the keys to my car or anything.
As far as lack of progress, I'm almost absolutely sure that's because you're taking the work too seriously.
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Post by shawnhartnell on Aug 22, 2012 14:48:18 GMT -6
Strangely enough, I had this part of the Commentaries at hand....
"To take life as an end in itself is not to understand the work, and it may cause a wrong attitude which may be the source of many negative emotions and of useless efforts made in negative states. For to work in a negative way is useless. It is only through some kind of delight, some feeling of joy or pleasure or some genuine affection or desire, that a person can work and bring about any change of being in himself. Fear, for example, will not act in this way. A man may have some knowledge of truth, but unless he values it, unless he feels some delight in it, it cannot affect him. It cannot act on him, for a man unites with truth only through his love, as it were, and in this way his being is changed. But if he is negative, then his love-life—that is, his emotional side—is in a wrong state and it will be the same if he is in a state of fear and feels compelled to do something against his will. To do a thing willingly, from a delight in doing it, will effect a change in you."
Seek the prophet Eddie ....
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Post by lokidreaming on Aug 22, 2012 16:49:27 GMT -6
@cs, I orginally sent you a PM mail asking advice where I should post one of my postings, you adviced me I should post it as a blog rather as a forum, therefore I posted it on the blogs there and I decided to post it here for feedback. This post was a private email that I sent to both you and VS and in response he recommended "all of this should be stated, asked discussed on the CoC forum and/ or social network...."Hence the reason for this posting. @cs @vs @shawn Hartnell @everyone elseI do not have anyone I feel that I can turn to in any areas of my life, therefore all my frustrations and fluxes are being unintentionally channeled towards the CoC. I know I have to find a way of channeling these frustraions and fluexs away from the CoC as I saw this possible chain of events happening long ago. I am well aware why I have these fluxed and have been trying very hard to make the arcs not so wide. Shawn hit the nail on the hit when he used the octave example in one of his responses. It is my refusal to prove myself which is the problem and not my need to prove myself as stated. I refuse to prove myself to anyone due to some painful experiences I have had; I refuse to as a way not to let the other person control me aka mould me to their image. I have learnt others to be and let them grow in their own ways, with a little proding from time to time to help them along. In other areas of my life, yes I feel the need for acceptance and aprroval from the everyday SHEEPLE, but with other seekers like the CoC, I am not...just being a chicken shit and not being honest with my struggles, progress and lack of progress. This is due to my fear my others moulding me the want me to be. I have practised (for years) not letting people know how much they have affected/helped me changed for the better as I have learnt if you do, they start getting annoying. This part I truly am sorry for. I felt, you guys needed to know this part I have holding back. As I have badly tried to hint the last two years I know who I am, it is the other people interferring ways that drives me bonkers, which I continously have been struggling with. I need to find people I can converse with in my everday life to stop my frustration spilling over to the CoC. I wanted to go that group for personal struggles but decided not to join that group as I felt that was a trap in itself and decided to post those posts on the main forum/blogs as a trail by fire to make me stronger. @shawn You are not the first person to come to the conclusion I am taking this too way seriously and I totally agree. cain Da'arnesh Thank you for your feedback and totally agree with you. Belief IS Reality Loki Deaming
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Post by sin on Aug 22, 2012 17:57:59 GMT -6
Yes, I did. This was my suggestion for some of your emails. I was asking you to reflect on your postings over the last 30 days.
An example of acceptance and attention seeking was placing the title of your topic in ALL CAPS.
CS
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Post by lokidreaming on Aug 22, 2012 19:21:12 GMT -6
Yes, I did. This was my suggestion for some of your emails. I was asking you to reflect on your postings over the last 30 days.
An example of acceptance and attention seeking was placing the title of your topic in ALL CAPS.
CSOne of the reasons why I choose that title was I realized how similar most paths are if you compare them to each other and how each path can originate from one main destinations and can lead to the same end destinations no matter if one is o RHP or the LHP (I know this is limiting terminology). Therefore why choose the path one is on and not the other, is this the reason for peoples confusion on the path, as they realize they are overwhelmed by choices and paths. When I watched that stated documentary I saw Ouspensky and bennets stubbornness reflected back at me and pondered over if one should take a leave of absence like O did and come back like the Prodigal Son. @cs I know I was not seeking acceptance and attention seeking the way you have interpreted it. That is all I have to say on this matter. So, I am going to take your advice and others and do my best to come up with workable solutions. If my solutions are not up to peoples standards, I can't do much but take ponder over their suggestions and advice.
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Post by I AM the Way on Aug 23, 2012 8:22:56 GMT -6
Strangely enough, I had this part of the Commentaries at hand....
"To take life as an end in itself is not to understand the work, and it may cause a wrong attitude which may be the source of many negative emotions and of useless efforts made in negative states. For to work in a negative way is useless. It is only through some kind of delight, some feeling of joy or pleasure or some genuine affection or desire, that a person can work and bring about any change of being in himself. Fear, for example, will not act in this way. A man may have some knowledge of truth, but unless he values it, unless he feels some delight in it, it cannot affect him. It cannot act on him, for a man unites with truth only through his love, as it were, and in this way his being is changed. But if he is negative, then his love-life—that is, his emotional side—is in a wrong state and it will be the same if he is in a state of fear and feels compelled to do something against his will. To do a thing willingly, from a delight in doing it, will effect a change in you."
This.
Awake!
VS
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