|
Post by deformity on Oct 12, 2014 9:02:06 GMT -6
I am here to talk about human sacrifice in a "theoretical" sense since murder is illegal, but anyway if you "were" to sacrifice someone to the Old ones how would you do it. Remember this is a theoretical question. Remember to make that clear
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on Oct 13, 2014 2:09:34 GMT -6
Just read "Cthulhu cult" Venger Satanis explain it well.
Awake !
|
|
|
Post by deformity on Oct 13, 2014 8:15:01 GMT -6
oh I read it. wait for the apocalypse. this is just for a little sadism. hope it didn't offend anyone. I wanted to to here whats different forum members grasp on it. nobody alike to the T. even when it comes to sadism
|
|
|
Post by shawnhartnell on Mar 16, 2015 14:37:52 GMT -6
deformity: The idea of sacrificing a person to some dark diety or to anything else is someone else's idea -- not mine. I wasn't eating a ham sandwich one day and suddenly had the irresistible need to 'sacrifice' someone. But, let's assume that someone 1.) asked me to sacrifice someone or 2.) expects it out of me. Well dammit -- 1.) That's a lot to ask. So, can't be bothered. Besides that, it would be a totally douchy thing to do to someon not to mention that it would prove someone stupid beyond a doubt. (You must die, er... because someone asked me to kill for them and er... I lack the ability to think for myself so er... DIE!) <-- Heh Fuck that shit. 2.) Pffft. On the other hand, in the Fourth Way we are asked to sacrifice something very difficult to give up -- our own unnecessary suffering. We are also asked not to take our suffering out on other people (to stop the expression of negative emotions). In that respect, sacrificing someone would be totally counter productive and also a really good way to totally screw ourselves. (This is not a limitation on killing for rational reasons, such as self-defense.)
|
|
|
Post by Padowan on Mar 16, 2015 22:15:39 GMT -6
So, if you are to sacrifice something very difficult to give up, would that include relationships? Someone you cared deeply for? That would seem to be deep and unnecessary suffering.
|
|
|
Post by shawnhartnell on Mar 17, 2015 0:05:52 GMT -6
It's just the unneccesary suffering.
|
|
|
Post by deformity on May 17, 2015 17:20:26 GMT -6
well shawnhartnell to be completely honest from what ive read about the great old ones and the outer gods they would disagree with you completly. if you read anthing about eliphas levi or aleister crowley and the opinions they had which were stated in the black arts by richard cavendish they would also disagree. the old ones and there servitors have killed plenty of mundane mucks in lovecrafts novels, and personaly i would love to cut someones head off with a single blow in the name of azathoth. because i am a true azathothist. i may not belong to the cult because i am an independent cultist who chooses to serve the outer gods who excist at the court of azathoth and do not agree with all the cults opinions on external issues. human sacrifice is the ultimate offering because it is the ultimate offering of life force. no morals and thats that. wicked to the day i die. and Nyarlathotep would support me
HAIL AZATHOTH HAIL Nyarlathotep DEATH TO THE SHEEP
|
|
|
Post by shawnhartnell on May 20, 2015 6:04:47 GMT -6
You do understand we're into Chaos Magick?
HAIL A CAB HAIL, MAN, SHIIIT DEATH TO ... CHILL THE FUCK OUT
|
|
|
Post by deformity on May 25, 2015 15:09:06 GMT -6
i was perfectly calm when i wrote that post, you seem to be the only one to be irritated by it which to me is very funny. as well as if something your sacrificing is unnecessary than its not that much of a sacrifice, while one human would hold another as the highest. and i would also like to say human sacrifice to me is not that very negative but very exciting and joyous, as i beleive it would be the ultimate spiritual charge for magickal works. i guess i dont share you peoples moral fiber
|
|
|
Post by shawnhartnell on May 25, 2015 22:29:59 GMT -6
Heh We don't have a moral fiber. lol And now I get it. This has been just another round of "Who's more evil!" Tell 'em what he's won Chuck! Well Bob, he's won absolutely nothing except a recommendation to check out other LHP organizations because here, that's the kind of thing we just don't give a flying fuck about. Back to you Bob. Congratulations, deformity -- you're more evil than the Cult of Cthulhu! Awww! Unfortunately that means you missed that the Cult has always been beyond concepts like good and evil. Good luck in the future with your badass evil self. But please, don't bother us with it. On the other hand if you can come up with a valid argument that's more valid than the cover of an 80's heavy metal record and a pointless need to be seen as badass while anonymous on the internet, come on back and try again.
|
|
Deleted
Deleted Member
Posts: 0
|
Post by Deleted on May 26, 2015 6:55:48 GMT -6
Deformity quietly asked and argued about a theoretical question.
Is this topic about the pleasure of being evil ? I see it as precisely being above good or evil, sacrificing not for the pleasure of inflicting pain, but for a higher goal, regardless of what our pitiful society consider as being evil.
If you think a bit about it, there are A LOT of practical problems, though...
So, yes theoretically it's a good thing, but practically it's definitively impossible here and now, and we can forget about it.
AWAKE
|
|
|
Post by shawnhartnell on May 26, 2015 10:42:59 GMT -6
If it's a talk about the pleasure of anything, it's sadism. A more appropriate place for that would be any BDSM site which are now popping up like zits due to popularity if 50 Shades of Gray.
I actually recommend that he take it there because in the right group it's possible to talk about it without mixing it up with other unrelated things like it has been in this thread. But maybe deformity is the kind that lacks self-awareness and needs the masks and props.
Don't get me wrong, I identify as a sadomasochist, but that's a private side of myself I rarely ever talk about publicly. Though, I might participate in a thread which is sincere, addresses the topic directly and shows some self-awareness.
The thing about sacrificing your suffering is that it's like letting go of a live wire -- you could rationally know you're better off letting go but it requires intelligence and will to free yourself from it. It's difficult, because the muscles in your hand are already working against the you to maintain the suffering.
To say it's easy to sacrifice your suffering reveals lack of experience through arrogance. In other words, what he's telling us is that he's not working on himself. In contrast, the COC values effort and experience, self-awareness and personal evolution. Arrogant masterbation is simply silly.
The thing about being beyond (I don't think of it as above, but larger and more encompassing) good and evil is that My Songs Knows What You Did In The Dark
I do enjoy lightin' em up, and that has at least a four different valid meanings simultaneously -- just from what I can think of from the top of my head.
|
|
|
Post by shawnhartnell on May 26, 2015 15:08:02 GMT -6
Yrright has an excellent point, so I'm going to clairify and expand on that, as well as prattle on a bit about myself. By identifying as a sadomasochist, I'm identifying both as a sadist and a masochist. My masochist side is more publically known than my sadist side as one thing I'm known to bleat often is "Pavement is my greatest teacher", meaning the pavement which whacks me when I fall off my skateboard, but meaning it in more of a globally metaphorical sense. In other words, I got that Failure Into Feedback frame from NLP fully installed. Most masochists aren't simply people who enjoy pain. That would be more of a simple automatic and associative fetish like getting a woody when they look at a shoe. Some of them who are not very evolved are into masochism as a form of self-flaggelation which has a very sound track record as a form of initiation -- but only for people who hate themselves. It's a shitty way to go but sometimes a necessary and useful one. Many masochists (myself included) are into it as a sort of challenge. The challenge is "can I face the pain without clocking out (while maintaining full awareness)" which makes sort of like a trial by fire. To come out the other end of that is nothing less than fucking exhilarating. I'm also counterphobic, which means I run directly into it if I fear it, and it's pretty much the same thing. (William James was right, you are afraid because you run away, but he missed the bistable mechanism which determines the hedonic tone. Yup, this is me making a connection and rambling. to make sure I remember it later. Feel free to ignore it.) What I've highlighted here is that there are two kinds of suffering, mechanical and intentional (or voluntary, as it's sometimes said in the Fourth Way). Mechanical suffering is like the simple fetish where there's a stimulus = response mechanism (associative conditioning) that's been built up or burned in. The metaphor of the grasping a live wire is a good illustration of a more complex form of mechanical suffering where your machine is performing it's function in a counterproductive way which you have no direct way of changing. The hand's function is to grasp, but the direct current from the wire causes the muscles of the hand to grasp it -- thus causing you to keep getting shocked by it. (The Fourth Way is the path of the "sly man", sly meaning indirect. This is what's meant by that. Since you can't directly change the situation you have to go about it indirectly.) Intentional suffering is when you make the conscious decision to fully feel your suffering and stay conscious through it rather than clocking out in any number of various degrees (ignoring it, misdirecting yourself, reframing it, etc.) We train ourselves to take suffering as a signal to wake up and pay attention rather than "dealing with it as those dead people do", as Tyler Durden put it. (Also, the practice is mentioned at the beginning and end of Antichrist Superstar album which begins and ends with the line "Know that when you are suffering that I have betrayed you.") This practice of intentionally suffering is suffering for a "higher purpose" -- expanding your own consciousness and thus further aiding your own personal evolution. It is not "sacrificing your son because God says so" as would seem to meet deformitys definition -- that's just being a bitch for a higher power. (Deformity, you may have noticed that we don't do that round these here parts.) In the Fourth Way, suffering is to be taken as it comes,as fully as possible and seeking out it out is advised against. I have a habit of taking suffering to the next level -- a sort of recreational elective suffering, meaning I seek out new and interesting ways to suffer, usually by seeing something that seems impossible and doing just that -- or jumping directly into conflicts I could simply let slide. There's advantages like getting more benefit from the dojo because I'm in it more plus the (over)self-confidence that comes with knowing you've made it through shit before, But there's problems with this approach. For example, it's easy to become an adrenalin fueled asshole and the burn-out prone overachiever. It distorts the natural shape of your being, which is why I think the Fourth Way advises against it (and why I think Venger Satanis drilled BALANCE into us.) To sum up: it's difficult to sacrifice your mechanical suffering, but at the same time it's more difficult to intentionally suffer -- and you have to intentionally suffer to sacrifice your mechanical suffering. As an illustration -- intentionally cutting your hand off to free yourself from the influence of the electric current. Your suffering will be for a higher purpose -- to stay alive instead of slowly cooking. As Jeezer pointed out "If thine eye offend thee, pluck it out: tis better that the eye burn in hell than the entire body suffer." Intentional suffering happens at the gap or break point between the notes in the octave. It's the moment where you can't afford to coast along and you have to do something you don't want to do intentionally -- it's the essence of the "Do or DIE!" moment and why more than just being Captian Adrenalin Beefcake or Pretentious Better Than You Motherfucker -- these are default options which lead to DIE (falling asleep). Only those who value the profits of effort in their personal evolution take the Do route. As Mr. O pointed out: "Desire is when you do what you want, will is when you can do what you don't want." With all this said, I can think of one fictional example of killing a living creature which could, if real, lead to serve one's own personal evolution -- the execution of Old Yeller. deformity: Hey man, nice shot -- I think it used to annoy me a bit that the LHP misses out on all this in favor of projected badassery and masterbation to one's own imagined self-image -- the epitome of this being conversations about human sacrifice -- but it doesn't suprise me anymore. I've accepted it as a way to tell those who are capable of getting real from those who don't -- exactly in the same way someone's views on crystal gazing does reveals that they'd rather imagine something in a crystal sphere and act mysterious than do any real work. Another way to tell is that people who use their views on their feelings about imagining sacrificing people also tend to make morality an issue because, you know, that proves how much better than those who don't agree with their views on their own imagination. The ones who try to claim that the practice of human sacrifice is a valid method of personal progression fail to realize that what someone has to do to progress is individual because we all start with different parts of us actualized while others remain undeveloped. There's no point in working on doing extra arm exercises when they're already in shape and your legs are withered. Understanding this is much more important if you actually want to walk the path and their fixation on human sacrifice shows them what they really value -- a scary costume.
|
|
|
Post by deformity on May 26, 2015 18:21:33 GMT -6
the only reason i havent gone ahead with human sacrifice is because i dont want to spend my life in prison. but if laws and morals were thrown aside like it says it will be when cthulhu rises in the "call of cthulhu i probably would. people need to be beyond good and evil. good and evil are just concepts created in the human mentality. so yeah ofcourse ive never commited human sacrifice during a ritual. wait for a large scale EMP to hit the united states and watch all laws and morals be thrown in the trash. P.S when i met theoretical, i meant exactly that, i just get ethusiastic about the idea. and second no one can tell me from the end of the forum whether or not ive been putting any work in. im just trying to express my opinions and ideals while hearing others opinions and ideals because life is a lesson that never ends. yes i may fantasize about homicide in my spare time, the point is with human sacrifice it has a productive purpose (spiritualy and for the sake of population control in a world filled with idiots and sheep). fuck trying to be a badass, try to go through the process of Apotheosis and and reach the level of godhood, AND DO WHAT EVER IS NECESSARY. ofcourse magic doesnt have to require human sacrifice, but my true question is what are you willing to do to reach godhood
|
|
|
Post by shawnhartnell on May 26, 2015 19:39:08 GMT -6
"the only reason i havent gone ahead with human sacrifice is because i dont want to spend my life in prison"
You completely missed the point of my first few posts in the thread: why are you considering it in the first place? why waste your time to even formulate an opinion on it?
Don't bother saying you came up with the idea -- it's done to death. How does forming an opinion about what other sheep are baying about make you any less a sheep? That's right -- you have an opinion about himan sacrifice only because it's a popular topic for people to have an opinion about. It's exclusively popular among wanna be badasses.
One more time: we don't give a flying fuck about any of that shit. If you wanna talk about what's talked about by wanna be badasses who SAY THEY WILL DO WHATEVER IT TAKES AND NEVER BOTHER CONSIDER IF IS EVEN NECESSARY OR WHY, the Cult isn't for you. You gotta see use your brain here.
What's keeping you from cutting off someone's cock, putting it on a hot dog bun and eating it raw? The police? Or is it that sheep haven't made it controversial enough for you? Or is it because there's no easy answers to choose from and claim as your own opinion? Both that and human sacrifice are equally as pointless. They only differ in popularity.
" and second no one can tell me from the end of the forum whether or not ive been putting any work in"
You can demonstrate your understanding or conversely the lack if it, and if you don't understand what you're doing then how can you be doing anything but stumbling around?
"but my true question is what are you willing to do to reach godhood"
What would YOU do for a Klondike bar? What difference does it make?
|
|
|
Post by Padowan on May 26, 2015 22:23:57 GMT -6
the only reason i havent gone ahead with human sacrifice is because i dont want to spend my life in prison. but if laws and morals were thrown aside like it says it will be when cthulhu rises in the "call of cthulhu i probably would. people need to be beyond good and evil. good and evil are just concepts created in the human mentality. so yeah ofcourse ive never commited human sacrifice during a ritual. wait for a large scale EMP to hit the united states and watch all laws and morals be thrown in the trash. P.S when i met theoretical, i meant exactly that, i just get ethusiastic about the idea. and second no one can tell me from the end of the forum whether or not ive been putting any work in. im just trying to express my opinions and ideals while hearing others opinions and ideals because life is a lesson that never ends. yes i may fantasize about homicide in my spare time, the point is with human sacrifice it has a productive purpose (spiritualy and for the sake of population control in a world filled with idiots and sheep). fuck trying to be a badass, try to go through the process of Apotheosis and and reach the level of godhood, AND DO WHAT EVER IS NECESSARY. ofcourse magic doesnt have to require human sacrifice, but my true question is what are you willing to do to reach godhood Hello Deformity. Pleasure to meet you.
You have begun a thread on how to go about sacrificing a human that resulted in you wanting to achieve Apotheosis, or obtaining godhood. What is the ultimate aim in Apotheosis for you? 1) Achieving respect 2) Admiration? 3) Arrogance?
You have a grandiose idea of godhood in which you can bestow judgment upon the worth of a life that is not your own. But for each, respect, admiration and arrogance, requires the very thing you despise - others. The sheep. You seek validation in others admiration and respect, or admonishment of your arrogance. You seek outside of yourself. You 'fantasize' of inflicting judgment and pain to increase your internal self-worth. You seek followers.
Self-deification, as opposed to godhood, refers to an inner guide rather than an external acceptance.
You could benefit from 4th way work and readings.
|
|
|
Post by Padowan on May 27, 2015 7:31:47 GMT -6
I left out one last possible reason for pursuing godhood.
Power
But power over what? In your case, power over someone's life or death. The power over life and death is an unnecessary burden, like herding sheep, culling the flock, and laboring over caring for the herd. Power over others in actuality gives them power over you - as you are now burdened with keeping them in line and cleaning up your sacrificial messes.
Power over yourself is more productive and exceedingly liberating. And no one can dethrone you.
|
|
|
Post by shawnhartnell on May 27, 2015 16:25:30 GMT -6
To quote what Julie Winters said to Mr. Gone:
"Sure, you can kill me, but so what? So can any junkie on my block."
|
|