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Post by cthulhuist09 on May 9, 2009 13:15:01 GMT -6
and fallows the path of a Cthulhu's teachings
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Post by Shaz'rahjeem on May 10, 2009 2:50:01 GMT -6
I think you might wanna post that stuff in the intro thread and give some detail. Like what you mean by you 'follow his teaching', how you follow it, or pertaining to what type of gnostic state.
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Post by Zirna'ritee-sigth on Jan 23, 2010 7:21:13 GMT -6
1. What is the ultimate goal of the COC? For its loyal and steadfast members such as myself it is to bring forth a total state of true awakening, to know and fully realise that the general accepted reality is a mere figmant ov the imgination and from which can be attained a power to shape its substance into whatever form the will desires. In essence it is to become as the gods we so long ago created for ourselves.
2. What makes the COC unigue By the combination ov various Lovecraftian occult values introduced by its members and founded upon the principles as writ in The Fourth Way, which is based on the teachings of G. I. Gurdjieff, its uniqueness manifests in the total dedication to the true-shadow of the self and allow its learned members to dissolve once and for all, all illusion.
3. What contributions does the COC make in human development? On a indivdual level it will allow them to empower themselves in a way never before experinced and be in service to the self via raw undiluted truth. Socially it will bring forth a more productive enviroment in all current enterprises which will lead to a type of government that functions in harmony for the first time with the latter two.
4. Is a 'cult', and 'cult theologies' essential in seeing its goal manifest? One of the things that must be understood that this word cult can mean so many things as each and every one of you have already taken a bised stance from how the media has portrayed the activities of groups acting under the banner of a cult. So I will play along and my response is that any ideology such as ours will manifest that which is a type of theological philosophy which empowers the goals it sets for itself. Intent begets action ending in the desired result.
5. In what regard is Venger Satanist, a 'cult' leader? That word crops up alot does it not. What has been forgotten that it had been shortened from the word occult which is a reference to something which is kept hidden. Throughout the ages of mankind the core of social interaction be it ov the old tribal groups or ov its modern counterpart has been bound by the teachings of shamans, preists and leaders. At the start the teachings were jealously guarded for it bestowed power thus it was occulted, kept hidden from the common people even unto kings and queens. Venger is first and formost a teacher to those willing to accept those hidden teachings which are freely available to those ready to learn anew. He provides the necessary guidance for those wishing to become students and offer a way for all its members to become leaders. After all we all strife for self-empowerment, self-improvement. All of us have the potential to become akin to the elite. It all begins with a choice.
6. In what regard are you a follower? You are a follower aren't you? Isn't that what cult leaders do? Lead followers? I can't help but be amused. You speak as if you do not follow anyone or anything. Do you not hold admiration to your own governmental leaders? Do you not strife to follow the advice and sage wisdom they offer? To provide them with assistance to the plans they bring forth to society, to be part of the social construct you help build for them? Your life is empty and redundant. You have allowed others to steal away your wonder and supplant with something that reduces mind to a mechanical shell.
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Post by Kyuubi on Apr 12, 2010 22:15:33 GMT -6
I think the goal of the CoC should be the goal of any LHP organization, mainly teaching this world has a dark side to it and that we can use it to our advantage. First subgoal should be to teach people about the ugly truth nobody wants to see, in other words that this world is suffering, that there is injustice in our world and that we have selfish drives. Second subgoal, that not everything that seems evil or bad should be eliminated or sublimated but used to further both the individual and humanity as a whole. I think the CoC is incomplete as a LHP group is in the illusion of being separate and self-suficient and makes the same mistake of RHP groups. I think RHP/LHP is the ideal, so the CoC should be a subset of a larger light/dark religion, like the ancient Egyptian religion that had a temple for Osiris (light) and Set (darkness). Dark and Light, are highly subjective and as a LHP'r I completely reject duality and 'balance' these things are nothing but delusions to me. If this organization starts spewing that nonsense, I'm outta here! Agreed. Duality is a joke.
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Post by LostSoul on Apr 14, 2010 19:01:22 GMT -6
Agreed. Duality is a joke. Hmmm... *arches eyebrow*
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Post by Kyuubi on Apr 15, 2010 14:14:30 GMT -6
I believe that all stems from chaos which means all is chaos. Aka, non dualistic.
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Post by egodiabolus on Apr 15, 2010 16:41:55 GMT -6
Duality may be "a joke", but it will kick your ass if you don't get the punch-line.
It is really all a matter of scale. On one end of the scale is "absolute", the sum totality of everything. On the other end of the scale is "nothingness", the total absence of anything. "Absolute", by its definition, has to include "nothingness" to be complete, and to be the total absence of everything "nothingness" must be absolute. They are thus one and the same, and duality does not exist.
At least, not on the largest of scales.
Where we are, however, is very, very, very far from the grandiose scale where all and nothing are one. Stretched out on a line between "all" and "nothing", we find ourselves very near the center. Here, everything appears through duality; active and passive, action and cessation, male and female. All we know at this scale is shaped by being nearly equally placed between the absolute-nothingness and the nothing-absolute.
Each duality has no truth. Each duality is subjective. The act of doing nothing is not passivity, but activity. The busiest effort is often passive in its nature and results. Each example is a scale where a thing shifts from one form to another form. In actuality, we live not in a dual-state but in a triplex. Every force has a passive state that becomes active and then passive again. Every "dual" scale follows along the line of active-neutral-passive. Because the neutral aspect is transitional, we often ignore it.
These scales of duality are subjective. Activity to one person is passivity to another, the same as "positive and negative" or "beneficial and malignant" are all subjective. Indeed, they are all different points along the same line; pain and pleasure are two points along the same experience. But, this is where we are, ruled by vacillations between one extreme and the next, asleep-awake, productive-destructive, breath in... breath out.
We can talk all day long about the weaknesses of a dualistic point of view, but try living outside dualism (triplex). Anything you try will have an equal-and-opposite reaction. We have the facility to understand that duality is false, but where we are it is the rule, so we must learn to live by that rule until we find a way to be free of it... until we move up or down the line toward absolute-oblivion or oblivious-totallity.
The necessity of our organism to breath a certain mixture of gasses can also be considered a joke. After all, it makes us earthbound when the vast majority of reality is void of the gases we require. But, that is another of the rules in our current place.
Duality is a joke, but what would you, could you do, outside it?
Ia Ia Cthulhu Fhtagn!
Ego Diabolus Priest of R'lyeh Cult of Cthulhu
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Post by Kyuubi on Apr 15, 2010 19:40:29 GMT -6
Well I admit I was just shot down. Well played. My anger with duality is that it is the law. I feel like if i act like it does not exist then in some way I can bypass it.
You presented that idea well I have not seen much about the active neutral and passive.
After I made this comment I started thinking about how shallow my idea was. I started thinking about my satanic roots and pagan influences. How can I believe in satanic ideals if everything is presented in only one direction.
Thanks Ego Diabolus; much respect.
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Post by beastx on Apr 16, 2010 8:58:33 GMT -6
Duality may be "a joke", but it will kick your ass if you don't get the punch-line.
It is really all a matter of scale. On one end of the scale is "absolute", the sum totality of everything. On the other end of the scale is "nothingness", the total absence of anything. "Absolute", by its definition, has to include "nothingness" to be complete, and to be the total absence of everything "nothingness" must be absolute. They are thus one and the same, and duality does not exist.
At least, not on the largest of scales.
Where we are, however, is very, very, very far from the grandiose scale where all and nothing are one. Stretched out on a line between "all" and "nothing", we find ourselves very near the center. Here, everything appears through duality; active and passive, action and cessation, male and female. All we know at this scale is shaped by being nearly equally placed between the absolute-nothingness and the nothing-absolute.
Each duality has no truth. Each duality is subjective. The act of doing nothing is not passivity, but activity. The busiest effort is often passive in its nature and results. Each example is a scale where a thing shifts from one form to another form. In actuality, we live not in a dual-state but in a triplex. Every force has a passive state that becomes active and then passive again. Every "dual" scale follows along the line of active-neutral-passive. Because the neutral aspect is transitional, we often ignore it.
These scales of duality are subjective. Activity to one person is passivity to another, the same as "positive and negative" or "beneficial and malignant" are all subjective. Indeed, they are all different points along the same line; pain and pleasure are two points along the same experience. But, this is where we are, ruled by vacillations between one extreme and the next, asleep-awake, productive-destructive, breath in... breath out.
We can talk all day long about the weaknesses of a dualistic point of view, but try living outside dualism (triplex). Anything you try will have an equal-and-opposite reaction. We have the facility to understand that duality is false, but where we are it is the rule, so we must learn to live by that rule until we find a way to be free of it... until we move up or down the line toward absolute-oblivion or oblivious-totallity.
The necessity of our organism to breath a certain mixture of gasses can also be considered a joke. After all, it makes us earthbound when the vast majority of reality is void of the gases we require. But, that is another of the rules in our current place.
Duality is a joke, but what would you, could you do, outside it?
Ego Diabolus Priest of R'lyeh Cult of Cthulhu
In the words of High Priest Satanis.....
"This."
Once you grasped and accept what Priest of R'lyeh Ego Diabolus has outlined here I started a thread called "The Birth of the Trinity" read it and lend me your thoughts please.
Beast Xeno First Priest of R'lyeh Cult of Cthulhu
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Kai'Sigth
Adeptus
Dreaming Herald of the Old Gods
Posts: 32
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Post by Kai'Sigth on Apr 20, 2010 18:43:09 GMT -6
Priest of R'lyeh Ego Diabolus,
Thank you. I've never quite looked at it in that way... That was probably one of the more enlightening descriptions of duality I have ever read.
First Priest Beast Xeno, I will be sure to read it and give you my input sometime in the near future.
I'll be honest, the philosophies discussed within this forum are a bit more complex then what I am used to even thinking about. Usually, my own philosophical musings only go as far as human social and animal nature and religious theory and practice. I've contemplated time and space but never in such a complex manner. I'm glad that I have access to such great minds as yours First Priest Beast Xeno and Priest Ego Diabolus and I in no way intend that to be some sort of shallow "kiss ass" statement.
Thanks for sharing your thoughts and theories.
Awake!
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Post by egodiabolus on Apr 24, 2010 7:47:54 GMT -6
Goals have been at the fore-front of my mind as of late; the idea keeps reoccurring in my studies and my individual efforts. This thread began as a discussion about the goals of the Cult of Cthulhu. I would like to take it back in that direction by asking the following question:
What are your goals for the Cult of Cthulhu?
The work breaks down into three lines of effort; self-work, group-work, and school-work. The self-work line seems to be a well-grasped concept by the members of this forum. The other two lines, group-work and school-work, may need some more explanation.
Group-work is not just working within a group. Just working within a group is still self-work, although we are each using one another as sounding boards for our ideas and discussing our theories and applications with one another. Group-work is work you do for the school (the Cult of Cthulhu) as instructed by the school. It is not work for the self, but work for others. If this were a physical school, you might come to a discussion about an idea that interests you. You may participate during this discussion, even presenting your ideas, but this is all still self-work. Group-work is going out and helping build a wall on the edge of the grounds, or working in a garden when instructed to do so, not only despite what you would like to do but in spite of what you would like to do.
In other words, a school will not only find for you work that doesn't directly relate to your personal goals, but work that the school knows you would not choose to do on your own. This offers a great opportunity for self-observation and remembrance. Intellectual persons would be asked to do physical labor, hands-on folks get asked to write papers, the wealthy are asked to clean toilets. The point is to make the student uncomfortable so that they have an opportunity to maybe observe their essence.
Obviously, the point would not be to necessarily produce good work, although it would hopefully be to the best of the student's ability. The third-line, school-work, is self-initiated like the first line, but the student chooses to do things for the betterment of the school. In other words, after completing the assigned task of filing documents all day indoors, the gardener goes out and works in the garden without being told to do so. They hopefully take what they learned through observation about themselves in the group-work and apply it to what they would like to do in their school-work. This could be not just their mechanical best, but their aware best.
With these ideas in mind, what are your goals for the Cult of Cthulhu? Also keep in mind that to have a goal, it takes more than to just have a desire. You need to also have a reason (why) and more importantly a plan (how), otherwise goals are imaginary. They may start there, but have to be filled-out to be legitimate. I began with the idea of being Awake... I mean, it sounds better than being asleep, right? But, did I really understand what being "awake" meant, or how to become "awake". Without that understanding, my goal wasn't even a desire... more like a vague interest. I had to learn what it meant to be awake, and to be able to walk around the concept in my own head, seeing it from as many angles as I could grasp. I came to understand that being more awake would mean potentially having more freedom to do what I would choose to do, even if it only meant I did less of what others wanted me to do that I did not need to. Being awake could mean that I could improve who I am, and could actively participate in my improvement. The how is though observation, remembering the self, and trying to change.
Thus, being “awake” for me is a goal.
My goals for the Cult of Cthulhu are that every person who chooses to participate become more Awake, and through becoming awake achieve not only their current aims, but aims that they have yet to even realize. I want this because I can learn from seeing this process repeated in others, that my state of wakefulness will improve thus making my own goals more likely to manifest. I will pursue this through discussing the work, presenting ideas, and striving to be an example of the success of the process.
It is my goal that the Cult of Cthulhu become the premier institution for what is often referred to as “Left Hand Path” philosophy. I want this because this will support the first goal; more people will be aware of the success of our members through the Work, they will elect to participate. All members will benefit through the constant growth and diversity that is brought by new members taking an interest in our efforts, our efforts will be made more successful through increased numbers and support. The likelihood of escape is greater when the conspiracy to do so is larger.
This leads to the return of the Old Ones, my third goal. This, to me, means the re-discovery and initiation of a paradigm that once held sway over our reality, when potential was not so limited and definitions not so set. This supports and is a consequence of the first two goals. By achieving those goals, we will serve as an example to others of what the other paradigm can be, encouraging interest in the shift and increasing the likelihood of its manifestation.
We are well on our way.
Ia Ia Cthulhu Fhtagn!
Ego Diabolus Priest of R'lyeh Cult of Cthulhu
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Post by warlockasylum on Apr 26, 2010 13:22:43 GMT -6
You still have not illustrated how these goals can be acheived by use of the material that CoC provides. Yes it sounds like a novel idea to engage in self-work, group-work, and school-work, but can you illustrate how the practices of CoC can help one in staying awake?
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Post by egodiabolus on Apr 26, 2010 18:45:48 GMT -6
You still have not illustrated how these goals can be acheived by use of the material that CoC provides. Yes it sounds like a novel idea to engage in self-work, group-work, and school-work, but can you illustrate how the practices of CoC can help one in staying awake? I hope that this question was truly for clarification, and not simply spurred by my “Validating or Invalidating the Necronomicon” thread. I am certain your activity on this thread is due to your attention being drawn by that former thread, but I would hate for you to feel you need to challenge what I am posting here out of spite. You are welcome to challenge everything I post, as anyone is, if you need a further explanation, or if my ideas are incorrect. I am here to learn more than I am here to instruct.
The idea of “self-work, group-work, and school-work” is not a “novel” idea. Its been around for some time. Ouspensky discusses these ideas in detail in The Fourth Way. “Novel” is an adjective meaning “of a new kind; different from anything seen or known before”. Ouspensky presents these ideas as also being of an even older origin. If you like I will sight the chapter and page numbers in The Fourth Way I am referring to, or perhaps I misunderstood your use of the word “novel”.
First, let us define the parameters of what we are talking about. In my post, I discussed my goals. These are my goals for the Cult of Cthulhu, where my focus is driven and what I wish to achieve through my efforts. I view these goals as being in line with the over-all goals of the Cult of Cthulhu, but each participating member will no doubt have their own goals and drives for that participation.
Given that we are discussing my goals, then we must also consider my answers to your question as my answers. These answers need only be satisfactory to me, as they support the “why” of my pursuit of these goals. They may or may not be satisfactory to others, though I believe most will approve of them.
My first stated goal is as follows:
“My goals for the Cult of Cthulhu are that every person who chooses to participate become more Awake, and through becoming awake achieve not only their current aims, but aims that they have yet to even realize. I want this because I can learn from seeing this process repeated in others, that my state of wakefulness will improve thus making my own goals more likely to manifest. I will pursue this through discussing the work, presenting ideas, and striving to be an example of the success of the process.”
Your question is “can you illustrate how the practices of CoC can help one in staying awake?” What are the practices of the Cult of Cthulhu? For me, those practices have involved discussions about the process of being awake vs. being asleep. High Priest Venger Satanis provides, through this forum, his books, and conversations he and I have had both privately and publicly (such as my occasional participation in “The Ooze” radio-show), an education in The Work that is akin to the manner presented by G.I. Gurdjieff, P.D. Ouspensky, and others. It is a round-about education, intentionally indirect, allowing the student to discover the information in their own time and manner.
In this way, I have become one of the resources and advocates for the Cult of Cthulhu and The Work. It is important here to distinguish between the Fourth Way and the Work engaged in by the Cult of Cthulhu, just as I have demonstrated a difference between the Simon Necronomicon and the system you practice based upon the Simon Necronomicon. Discussions with me by members and participation with me in this forum have helped in the pursuit of this goal. We are all relatively more awake than we were before our participation in this forum, our interaction and support of the Cult of Cthulhu, and our interactions with one another. “Wakefulness” is a relative state, so it would be up to each individual participant in the Work, this forum, and the Cult of Cthulhu to answer this question and to determine the validity of our practices for themselves.
“It is my goal that the Cult of Cthulhu become the premier institution for what is often referred to as “Left Hand Path” philosophy. I want this because this will support the first goal; the more people will be aware of the success of our members through the Work, they will elect to participate. All members will benefit through the constant growth and diversity that is brought by new members taking an interest in our efforts, our efforts will be made more successful through increased numbers and support. The likelihood of escape is greater when the conspiracy to do so is larger.”
Again, it is our practice of participation in this forum and the individuals that make up the Cult of Cthulhu itself that support this goal. We all have varied interests and ideas, many of which are related to the Left Hand Path. Many threads about these myriad concepts have been posted in this forum, and following the edicts of the Work requiring that all information that we pursue be tested for its validity for ourselves, we are developing a significant body of research on those topics for anyone with the inclination to review and validate or invalidate for themselves.
Our pursuit of this goal has lead to reaching outside the Cult of Cthulhu to share and learn with others who's works we have found valid and worthy of dissemination. The most recent example would be that of Jason King and his work Post-Modern Satanism. He was invited to discuss his ideas on The Ooze, and graced our listeners with his ideas, his wit, and his insights. This Occult research and discussion is another practice, along with the practices I mentioned above, that I view as supportive of my second stated goal.
“This leads to the return of the Old Ones, my third goal. This, to me, means the re-discovery and initiation of a paradigm that once held sway over our reality, when potential was not so limited and definitions not so set. This supports and is a consequence of the first two goals. By achieving those goals, we will serve as an example to others of what the other paradigm can be, encouraging interest in the shift and increasing the likelihood of its manifestation.”
This third goal is more truly a personally defined goal than the other two, thus my views on the practices of the Cult of Cthulhu will also be more personal. “The Return of the Old Ones” has a different meaning to different members, but thankfully ours is an organization that allows for flexibility in thought and perspective to encompass most of those different meanings. I do see our efforts and discussions leading to a paradigm shift. This shift may be only for the members who pursue the Work of the Cult of Cthulhu or may be more far reaching, this is something to be seen. We begin with Work upon and within ourselves. It is a change of state within ourselves that is paramount for all members of the Cult of Cthulhu... without pursuing that change all our other goals; personal goals for the Cult of Cthulhu or organizational goals defined by the Cult of Cthulhu, are meaningless.
Based on your posts since our discussion on the thread "Validating or Invalidating the Necronomicon", I can only guess at your intentions. You seem to have taken a genuine interest in the Cult of Cthulhu in the last 24-48 hours, though I see you have been a member since February of this year. I appreciate you wanting to challenge our ideas, that kind of gusto will make certain we remain true to ourselves and our efforts and not deluded by wishful thinking, metaphor, and incorrect self-representation.
I wanted to take this thread in the direction of other members stating their own goals for the Cult of Cthulhu. As a relatively new member, what are your goals for the Cult of Cthulhu? What do you hope to gain from participation in this forum, and what do you believe the Cult of Cthulhu has that will help you achieve your goals?
I eagerly await your response.
Ia Ia Cthulhu Fhtagn!
Ego Diabolus Priest of R'lyeh Cult of Cthulhu
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Post by warlockasylum on Apr 28, 2010 13:57:50 GMT -6
"I wanted to take this thread in the direction of other members stating their own goals for the Cult of Cthulhu. As a relatively new member, what are your goals for the Cult of Cthulhu? What do you hope to gain from participation in this forum, and what do you believe the Cult of Cthulhu has that will help you achieve your goals?"Thank you for clarifying your objectives in conjunction with the CoC. Although, I am not certain how others' spiritual progress can be listed as a personal goal, but I guess it is good for membership numbers. Whatever gets you through the night. warlockasylum.wordpress.com/2010/04/28/1630/I joined the CoC forum to see how others of the Necronomicon Tradition employ their understanding of the Lovecraft Mythos and I must say that I have found some very interesting observations, as well as, well-thought out research. This has enabled me to incorporate new ideas into my own solitare practice. I hope that I can be as much of benefit to others here as I have learned from their shared experiences. Yourself included.
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Post by beastx on Apr 28, 2010 16:48:19 GMT -6
Thank you for clarifying your objectives in conjunction with the CoC. Although, I am not certain how others' spiritual progress can be listed as a personal goal, but I guess it is good for membership numbers. Whatever gets you through the night. Warlock Asylum,
"I am not certain how others' spiritual progress can be listed as a personal goal"
I'm curious as to how it couldn't be. Obviously a person's spiritual progress is perpetuated only by their personal goals. Otherwise once again we see a person for the most part asleep at the wheel. I think perhaps you've left something out of the statement which would help me follow this thought. Mind filling in the blank?
AWAKE!
Beast Xeno First Priest of R'lyeh Cult of Cthulhu
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Post by egodiabolus on Apr 28, 2010 20:38:51 GMT -6
Although, I am not certain how others' spiritual progress can be listed as a personal goal, but I guess it is good for membership numbers. Whatever gets you through the night. This is an excellent observation and I will be more than happy to further clarify why others' spiritual progress is a personal goal, having a personal incentive.
What we are doing through the Work; trying to maintain longer periods of self-awareness and wakefulness, often requires that we behave in a manner that is counter to what we are taught in our social-programming. There is an incredible pressure to conform; to watch the right shows, wear the right clothes, think the right thoughts... To put it plainly, by working together we can bolster each others efforts to resist. It is easier to resist the tide as a team than as one man.
Scientists do not perform experiments independent of one another. When they make a discovery or think they proof of a theory, they invite their peers to test their data, often by repeating their experiments. In the Work, we take the same approach, sharing what we learn and offering encouragement to our peers in their own experiments.
Finally, as we develop an awareness that is more than the normal state of those who are not pursuing the Work, we may develop aims and interests that are not likely to be shared by the average person. It is like a tattoo-artist who spends his day thinking about tattoos, drawing tattoos, and performing tattoos... if all that really interests him are tattoos, little he says will be of interest to most people. The Work tends to create that distinction in those that pursue it; we turn our back on many of the trivialities embraced by the larger society and focus on aims that most of our mundane acquaintances would not appreciate.
That's not to say we turn our back on the world. Quite the contrary, it is important that we remain engaged in the world around us. It is just helpful to interact with others who share a common understanding.
It is possible to go it on your own. I believe, however, that the odds of my success are improved drastically when I am able to assist others in their own effort. I hope this answers your critical observation, and encourages you to consider the advantages of working with others who share your goals, if you are not already.
Awake!
Ego Diabolus Priest of R'lyeh Cult of Cthulhu
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Post by Sarak G'hash on Apr 28, 2010 20:55:30 GMT -6
Although, I am not certain how others' spiritual progress can be listed as a personal goal, but I guess it is good for membership numbers. Whatever gets you through the night. This is an excellent observation and I will be more than happy to further clarify why others' spiritual progress is a personal goal, having a personal incentive.
What we are doing through the Work; trying to maintain longer periods of self-awareness and wakefulness, often requires that we behave in a manner that is counter to what we are taught in our social-programming. There is an incredible pressure to conform; to watch the right shows, wear the right clothes, think the right thoughts... To put it plainly, by working together we can bolster each others efforts to resist. It is easier to resist the tide as a team than as one man.
Scientists do not perform experiments independent of one another. When they make a discovery or think they proof of a theory, they invite their peers to test their data, often by repeating their experiments. In the Work, we take the same approach, sharing what we learn and offering encouragement to our peers in their own experiments.
Finally, as we develop an awareness that is more than the normal state of those who are not pursuing the Work, we may develop aims and interests that are not likely to be shared by the average person. It is like a tattoo-artist who spends his day thinking about tattoos, drawing tattoos, and performing tattoos... if all that really interests him are tattoos, little he says will be of interest to most people. The Work tends to create that distinction in those that pursue it; we turn our back on many of the trivialities embraced by the larger society and focus on aims that most of our mundane acquaintances would not appreciate.
That's not to say we turn our back on the world. Quite the contrary, it is important that we remain engaged in the world around us. It is just helpful to interact with others who share a common understanding.
It is possible to go it on your own. I believe, however, that the odds of my success are improved drastically when I am able to assist others in their own effort. I hope this answers your critical observation, and encourages you to consider the advantages of working with others who share your goals, if you are not already.
Awake!
Ego Diabolus Priest of R'lyeh Cult of Cthulhu well that is awesome since i have NEVER EVER been a confomist! lol i've always had an incredibly open mind and have learned so much from all of you! Keep up the good work! Awake! Awake!
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Post by warlockasylum on Apr 29, 2010 9:03:45 GMT -6
egodee said: "This is an excellent observation and I will be more than happy to further clarify why others' spiritual progress is a personal goal, having a personal incentive.
What we are doing through the Work; trying to maintain longer periods of self-awareness and wakefulness, often requires that we behave in a manner that is counter to what we are taught in our social-programming. There is an incredible pressure to conform; to watch the right shows, wear the right clothes, think the right thoughts... To put it plainly, by working together we can bolster each others efforts to resist. It is easier to resist the tide as a team than as one man.
Scientists do not perform experiments independent of one another. When they make a discovery or think they proof of a theory, they invite their peers to test their data, often by repeating their experiments. In the Work, we take the same approach, sharing what we learn and offering encouragement to our peers in their own experiments.
Finally, as we develop an awareness that is more than the normal state of those who are not pursuing the Work, we may develop aims and interests that are not likely to be shared by the average person. It is like a tattoo-artist who spends his day thinking about tattoos, drawing tattoos, and performing tattoos... if all that really interests him are tattoos, little he says will be of interest to most people. The Work tends to create that distinction in those that pursue it; we turn our back on many of the trivialities embraced by the larger society and focus on aims that most of our mundane acquaintances would not appreciate.
That's not to say we turn our back on the world. Quite the contrary, it is important that we remain engaged in the world around us. It is just helpful to interact with others who share a common understanding.
It is possible to go it on your own. I believe, however, that the odds of my success are improved drastically when I am able to assist others in their own effort. I hope this answers your critical observation, and encourages you to consider the advantages of working with others who share your goals, if you are not already."Thanks for your kind response and clarification of your initial comments. I am finding somewhat of a coflicting thought here with what the CoC draws as one of its sources being the Fourth Way. I must first say though that the idea of drawing from Fourth Way sources and Satanic Thought coupled with Lovecraft is a good synthesis. Actually before I knew of the CoC influences, I also studied the same. You might try exploring this school as well: www.vampiretemple.comAfter reading your reply, I was reminded by something mentioned by Ouspensky in "Search of the Miraculous." I would like to get your opinion of Ouspensky's thoughts in veiw of your reply and your understanding on what is quoted below from page 23v 0f the said work: ""He is a weak man," said G. "People take advantage of him unconsciously of course. And all because he considers them. If he did not consider them, everything would be different, and they themselves would be different."
It seemed odd to me that a man should not consider others....Later on I understood what G. called "considering," and realized what an enormous place it occupies in life and how much rise it gives to. G. called "considering" that attitude which creates inner slavery, inner dependence."I must say that I had the blessed experience of having a few mentors in the Fourth Way studies, one knew Gurdjieff directly. Each of these teachers would pull the student aside when the had started off in the work, and would emphasize the need to be in the work for oneself. I am reminded of some people who call hemselves "master" and etc when reading the follwoing on page 226 of Ouspensky's work: ""Every man has a certain feature in his character which is central. It is like an axle round which all false personality revolves. Every man's personal work must consist in struggling against this chief fault. this explains why there can be no general rules of work and why all systems that attempt to evolve such rules either lead to nothing or cause harm....How can there be general rules? What is useful for one is harmful for another. One man who talks too much, he must learn to keep silent. Another man is silent when he ought to talk and he must learn to talk; and it is so always and in everything. General rules for the work of groups refer to everyone. Personal directions can only be individual. In this connection again a man cannot find his own chief feature, his chief fault, by himself. This is practically a law. The teacher has to point out this feature to him aand show him how to fight against it. No one else but the teacher can do this....All that has been said up till now refers to real groups connected with real concrete work which in its turn is connected with what has been called the "Fourth Way.' but there are many imitation ways, imitation groups, and imitation work. These are not even black magic."There is one very prominent 3rd generation Fourth Way student, also known as Simon, which explains his perspectives in Gates concerning "groups, " where the focus become more about the group than ones' individual progression. In light of Ouspensky's words, I am eager to hear how your reply correlates with all of this warlockasylum.wordpress.com/2010/04/28/1630/Warlock Asylum
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Post by egodiabolus on Apr 29, 2010 10:06:59 GMT -6
Thanks for your kind response and clarification of your initial comments. I am finding somewhat of a coflicting thought here with what the CoC draws as one of its sources being the Fourth Way. I must first say though that the idea of drawing from Fourth Way sources and Satanic Thought coupled with Lovecraft is a good synthesis. Actually before I knew of the CoC influences, I also studied the same. You might try exploring this school as well: www.vampiretemple.comAfter reading your reply, I was reminded by something mentioned by Ouspensky in "Search of the Miraculous." I would like to get your opinion of Ouspensky's thoughts in veiw of your reply and your understanding on what is quoted below from page 23v 0f the said work: The Cult of Cthulhu draws from many sources, but like any other organization is bound by none of them. The mix of Fourth Way/Satanism/Lovecraft Mythos is an intriguing synthesis, requiring that some things be accepted while other things are rejected or modified. It is not perfect, nor is it for everyone. For me, it continues to prove to be very effective, and I think myself fortunate for being introduced to it by High Priest Venger Satanis and for having the proper tools to be receptive of it.
Given that the rest of your statement does not have a direct relation to this thread (although there is some relevance for those interested in pursuing it), I have elected to respond to you directly through this forum's private message tool. Should this subject merit it, we may begin a new thread discussing the differences between "considering" and work for others.
Ia Ia Cthulhu Fhtagn!
Ego Diabolus Priest of R'lyeh Cult of Cthulhu
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Post by I AM the Way on Apr 29, 2010 11:04:09 GMT -6
I'm glad to see that you're taking an interest in our paradigm, influences, and methodology. And not only you, Warlock Asylum, but everyone involved in The Work.
As you've reminded us, it's not an easy thing. Narrow is the path, the eye of the needle, and so forth. Your chief feature comment illustrates the need for what I was saying before in that other thread: a conscious, organic Fourth Way Master. I was appointed to this level of mastery by the Great Old Ones you've read about in Simon's Necronomicon.
Doubt and question me if you will, but that is our reality. The Cthulhu Cult uses Gurdjieffian understanding as guidelines, not as concrete fixtures. As for the right versus Left Hand Path article, it was interesting. Working together makes sense, but when an organization or movement becomes too big, then it tends to degenerate into something mechanical... as well as pertaining to vampires and/or ninja.
To some eyes, our religion has reconciled the differences between the two paths, just as we have moved beyond good and evil. However, antinomianism and self-deification will always be of primary concern to Cultists.
I encourage you to keep the 4th Way discussion coming because how else are we going to learn, teach, and destroy this prison?
Ia Ia Cthulhu fhtagn,
Venger As'Nas Satanis Cult of Cthulhu High Priest
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Post by warlockasylum on Apr 29, 2010 11:46:48 GMT -6
Thank you very much for your reply. It is very much appreciated. I was appointed by the Old Ones, as well, or as we say in my school the Ancient Ones. You have done some good work here. I am enjoying it. I just wanted to make another statement aswell, since I was aksed to share my intentions for joining the forum. As a martuial artist, sometimes you may be prompted to study another form, so that nothing becomes to work on spefic areas in life. So from one Dragon to the other I would like to say thank you
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Post by I AM the Way on Apr 29, 2010 13:03:39 GMT -6
Hopefully, our numbers will only increase. I'm sure they will in due course.
I don't see any reason why we can't work together and even collaborate on Lovecraftian projects in the near future, Warlock Asylum. Our paradigm is very inclusive. Even someone like Dan Harms is encouraged to participate. There is a purpose to everything, a design. Figuring out exactly where we belong in this world shall reveal our true destiny.
Why suffer unintentionally when we are potentially the ones in full control? Broken machines dimensionally unfolding towards Godhood...
Your system has merit just as ours does. Focusing on the similarities might yield new fruit in undiscovered Gate Walking and Cthulhu Cult research. If it's possible to combine similar instrumentation in order to liberate the A:O (Ancient Ones) in addition to ourselves, then I say why not do just that?
We are on the verge of Walpurgisnacht. That should inspire us all to better things. Putting aside petty squabbles and differences so that a great new darkness might shine within that chartreuse void of elder stars and unquenchable, demonic thirst!
By His loathsome tentacles,
Venger As'Nas Satanis Cult of Cthulhu High Priest
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Post by egodiabolus on Apr 29, 2010 13:27:27 GMT -6
I want to be as tactful as possible with the following comment, but I wouldn't be doing my job if I didn't bring it up. This forum has certain simple rules for our participants that we ask be observed.
1. Within your first 10 posts or two weeks, whichever comes first, on the CoC discussion boards you will submit your introduction to the Introduction Board. Introductions are not one-line pronouncements that you are here. Please elaborate while putting your best tentacle forward.
2. Long ago, I created an unfortunate precedent for how I am referred to on the discussion boards. Now, I'm correcting it. This is the appropriate way to address me...
A. High Priest Venger Satanis
B. Master Satanis
C. Lord Satanis
3. When concluding each and every forum post (it is appreciated if every piece of writing you create outside the forum ends in a similar manner), you must use one of these nine phrases if you also happen to be an official and active member of the Cthulhu Cult. Non-Cultist forum members need not conclude their posts with the following (punctuation optional)...
A. ia ia Cthulhu fhatgn!
B. Hail Satanis!
C. His ichor cleanses the sin of all mankind.
D. When the stars are right!
E. Awake!
F. By His loathsome tentacles!
G. No man may cometh unto Yog-Sothoth, but by him.
H. The Cult of Cthulhu shall never die!
I. Remember yourself, for the Emerald Kingdom is at hand!
4. Everyone on the discussion boards is to be shown the utmost respect, consideration, and understanding... even those who would appear to be our enemy.
5. Do your best to fix spelling and grammatical errors (and please make use of distinct paragraphs) before clicking the Post Message button. If English is not your native language, then extra allowances will be made.
6. Be mindful of either the necessity or frivolity of your post on the CoC discussion boards. There is a subjective nature to the perceived gravitas of individual posts; however, Priest of R'lyeh Beast Xeno and I will do our very best to separate the wheat from the chaff.
7. The Cult of Cthulhu paradigm stems from me. I created it and through the use of these discussion boards, it has evolved. I am the Cthulhu Cult. While I abhor blatant ass-kissing, a certain amount of sincere gratitude is appreciated. This sincere gratitude can be shown by preaching, proselytizing, and promoting the following...
A. The Cult of Cthulhu
B. High Priest Venger Satanis
C. Our teachings
These rules can be taken as a way of encouraging self-remembering and awareness, a kind of "suffering" which makes us a bit more alert while posting here. It is also easier to take seriously a person who is presenting themselves as mindful, well-read, experienced, and intelligent when they use proper grammar and a simple spell-check program before posting. I believe that the spell-check is even an option offered when posting.
None of us are perfect in the obedience to these rules, but they should not be disregarded entirely by anyone.
By His loathsome tentacles!
Ego Diabolus Priest of R'lyeh Cult of Cthulhu
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Post by warlockasylum on Apr 29, 2010 14:37:19 GMT -6
Thanks for that update. Give me a second and I will submit the following criteria. I am currently working on an article for the Gate-Walker's Page concerning the good experiences that I have had in out discussions. I will keep you posted.
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Post by nixx on Apr 30, 2010 11:39:49 GMT -6
I've really enjoyed reading this discussion so far as I'm learning quite a bit in the interchange. Thanks to all for heading things this way!
When the Stars are Right!
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